West Ham

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: West Ham

I'm sure I remember a very established poster on here, and one that features heavily in this thread, telling us that Arsenal wouldn't fill their ground when they moved to the Emirates.

They don't

Along with man City there are plenty of empty seats on view

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: West Ham

Are you being purposely obtuse?

"midtable PL team" is what I said. I'm not saying 45k people would turn up to watch us play Luton, Coventry or West Brom but if we were an established Premier League team finishing midtable then I don't see why 45k is an unreasonable average crowd considering we were selling out a 33k stadium in a relegation season.

When we averaged 38k in the top flight the division average was ~31k. The division average is now ~38k. Crowds on a whole have increased since then, why do you think Cardiff City would be an exception?

You keep saying we only get big crowds for big games. Cup finals, promotions, etc and that our support is only ~16k. The Premier League is a big draw, one that's proven to draw our fairweather fans out in their thousands. If we spent 5 years in the Premier League do you think our 33k crowds would drop back to the ~20k average we've been having in the Championship for the past several years.

You are fishing for luckies

If , maybe etc

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: West Ham

On a separate note, If Bristol Rovers had a brand new 25,000 seater stadium , do you think they would fill it ?
Bristol City fans I know think Rovers are a small club, however , I think they are bigger than Bristol City.

Rovers have a very good away following but I think they lack that extra few thousand to trouble Bristol City

[A Quiet Monkfish]

Re: West Ham

The data proves that considering we have a catchment area of about 1 million , with no other professional club to compete with , this club does not get crowds on a regular basis to justify us being mooted as a big club , even by championship standards

I know this hurts people , we would all love CCFC to be getting better support from the locals but it's always been the same

Even a successful Cardiff City doesn't seem to hold onto its support . People fight to get season tickets when we go up but after the inevitable relegation 15000 of them disappear . I almost feel that locally people are there to watch the big teams as much as they are to watch us .

Cardiff fans and some of our players believe their own hype .....big club , massive club etc

We are no bigger than Swansea , Plymouth , Bristol , Coventry etc

It's sad but it's true

2 top flight appearances in the last 60 years haven't helped though.

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: West Ham

2 top flight appearances in the last 60 years haven't helped though.

Which doesn't happen to big clubs ?

17 years we spent in the lower leagues

Sheffield Wed , Sunderland , Leeds ......they tend to drag themselves back . And it's because they are big clubs ?

[A Quiet Monkfish]

Re: West Ham

Which doesn't happen to big clubs ?

17 years we spent in the lower leagues

Sheffield Wed , Sunderland , Leeds ......they tend to drag themselves back . And it's because they are big clubs ?

The other factor is in Wales people don't associate or have allegiances with local areas as the do in England. We [the population in general] are more likely to get enthused about a national success than something that's parochial. The Rugby clubs in Wales are poorly supported compared to those in England..

[Eric the Half a Bee]

Re: West Ham

A few thoughts about our attendances and basing them on success.

In terms of average league position we're ranked 39th.
In terms of seasons spent in the top division we're ranked 40th.
In terms of seasons spent in the top 2 divisions we're ranked 36th.

Our average attendance is ranked 32nd. That would suggest our crowds have been decent enough given our overall league performance. Had our attendance been ranked 50th or something, we could easily suggest that our crowds haven't supported the club well enough. Preston's average league ranking is 28th yet their average crowds are ranked 37th. There's a club that possibly isn't so well supported.

[NYCBlue]

Re: West Ham

The other factor is in Wales people don't associate or have allegiances with local areas as the do in England. We [the population in general] are more likely to get enthused about a national success than something that's parochial. The Rugby clubs in Wales are poorly supported compared to those in England..

That might be because rugby is posh in England.

[Tuerto]

Re: West Ham

Honestly mate give it up whilst you still can

45 k average support for ccfc ?

We don't have 45 k fans

A hardcore of around 16 k

What do you think that our hardcore support was 25 years ago?

[Father Dougal]

Re: West Ham

We sem to be bang average when it comes to crowds. We get more or less what we should in comparison to how good or bad we are and what level we play at. Our 2 seasons in the premier suggest that applies there also so if we were a mid table prem side i am sure we would be around the 45k mark. For the big games we could get 60k plus without too much difficulty. Nothing special about that mind. Of course criwds would drop as we went down etc...

[TWGL1]

Re: West Ham

We sem to be bang average when it comes to crowds. We get more or less what we should in comparison to how good or bad we are and what level we play at. Our 2 seasons in the premier suggest that applies there also so if we were a mid table prem side i am sure we would be around the 45k mark. For the big games we could get 60k plus without too much difficulty. Nothing special about that mind. Of course criwds would drop as we went down etc...

Wales used to get 74,000 for night matches at the Millennium Stadium, I’m assuming at least 40,000 of them would watch Cardiff against Manchester United, Manchester City, Liverpool and…… West Ham

[FormerlyJohnnyBreadhead]

Re: West Ham

You're absolutely kidding on if you don't think West Ham can't sustain that. Their support base is basically all of Essex and most of east London. If you don't like West Ham, fair enough, but they are absolutely 100% a big club in terms of their support.

Also, I've never heard of anybody (Cardiff fans or otherwise) refer to us as a big club, so I don't understand why you seem to have such a chip on your shoulder about that. We've got the potential to be a big club, sure, but I don't think anybody seriously claims that we are.

I guarantee that if we were semi-competitive in the PL, we'd get 30-33k every week. Would most of those people be Johnny Come Latelys? Probably. But that's the thing with sustained success, people stick around. Then they take their kids, and they become fans, and then those kids go with their friends from school, and so on.

But we never have been competitive in the top flight (or at least not for 60 odd years), so none of that has happened. Add to that the hooligan reputation that the club couldn't shake for years, and it's not surprising.

Whether or not we could fill the Millennium Stadium on a weekly is up for debate, but if we even finished top 10 in the Prem for 3 years in a row we would 100% be looking at 40-50k IMO.

[Eric the Half a Bee]

Re: West Ham

You're absolutely kidding on if you don't think West Ham can't sustain that. Their support base is basically all of Essex and most of east London. If you don't like West Ham, fair enough, but they are absolutely 100% a big club in terms of their support.

Also, I've never heard of anybody (Cardiff fans or otherwise) refer to us as a big club, so I don't understand why you seem to have such a chip on your shoulder about that. We've got the potential to be a big club, sure, but I don't think anybody seriously claims that we are.

I guarantee that if we were semi-competitive in the PL, we'd get 30-33k every week. Would most of those people be Johnny Come Latelys? Probably. But that's the thing with sustained success, people stick around. Then they take their kids, and they become fans, and then those kids go with their friends from school, and so on.

But we never have been competitive in the top flight (or at least not for 60 odd years), so none of that has happened. Add to that the hooligan reputation that the club couldn't shake for years, and it's not surprising.

Whether or not we could fill the Millennium Stadium on a weekly is up for debate, but if we even finished top 10 in the Prem for 3 years in a row we would 100% be looking at 40-50k IMO.

Post of the week. Sludge seemed to think that just by getting to the Championship that we should be selling out every home game.

[Swiss Peter]

Re: West Ham

They don't

If you are suggesting that Arsenal don't sell out their league matches then, sorry, but you are simply wrong.

[Kind of Blue]

Re: West Ham

Undoubtably a big club with a lot of support. Some of my relatives were originally from east London, Hammers, and in the time honoured tradition moved further east out into greater Essex.

Obviously east London is a relatively big area, but what I have been surprised by since living here myself now is - outside of the areas around the old Boleyn Ground - is how few signs of West Ham support I come across regularly. In the area I currently live in, which is about equidistant from Spurs and West Ham, is how much more Spurs support I see about the place (shirts, buttons, posters in shops, graff, etc). Easily the majority. Which may say more about relative success, and ease of getting to either ground (plus the Arsenal), than anything but a small thing that surprised me since moving here anyway.