20mph online petition

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Originally Posted by caerkid

The one thing I agree with Sunak on (but obviously for different reasons) is that the country isn't anywhere near ready to make the hard and uncomfortable decisions that will be needed in the coming years. We've got an entire entitled generation who have rarely had to sacrifice even an inch and who now see any small change as an attack on their freedom (and it's always 'their' freedom). Policies that say 'you making small changes with X would all add up to helping with Y' are never going to be accepted by these people and while I don't think they're quite the majority, they are often the loudest person in the room.

It's clear that the changes needed won't happen until that lot are gone or are safely drooling in their chairs (not too long to go though based on some of the evidence at least). I dread to think how the youngest generation will look back on this but atleast that's nothing new.

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Do you think this may be a rather dramatic escalation to the reality that most just want to see a return to the speed limits that we had in place a couple of weeks ago?

Just a smidge of an escalation?

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Originally Posted by the other bob wilson

Oh come on, all they’re doing is asking for the freedom to do whatever they want……………………..

and bugger the consequences for anyone else.

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Who has asked for there to be no consequences to speeding?

The debate is about the limit.

If I say the safe driving limit on some roads should be 30, and others say 20 that doesn't mean there is dispute that people exceeding the limits shouldn't be held responsible for it. It's a dispute over the limit itself.

The invention of strawmen in debates is so frustrating, but always illuminating.

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Originally Posted by JamesWales

Do you think this may be a rather dramatic escalation to the reality that most just want to see a return to the speed limits that we had in place a couple of weeks ago?

Just a smidge of an escalation?

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People got the arse in their hands when the 70mph speed limit was introduced, they won't go back as a bad reaction to limits is nothing new.

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Originally Posted by Der Kaiser

People got the arse in their hands when the 70mph speed limit was introduced, they won't go back as a bad reaction to limits is nothing new.

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I agree, it will be hard to go back now, although Lee Waters himself did say he expected some councils to do so, but I think that was him just trying to shift some responsibility on

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Originally Posted by poc

maybe you need to get the message 30 is not a target its the maximum allowed

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It should be the minimum on a lot of the wider safe 20mph roads around here.

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Originally Posted by JamesWales

This is literally the angriest post on here.

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Ha ha true :hehe:

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Originally Posted by caerkid

The one thing I agree with Sunak on (but obviously for different reasons) is that the country isn't anywhere near ready to make the hard and uncomfortable decisions that will be needed in the coming years. We've got an entire entitled generation who have rarely had to sacrifice even an inch and who now see any small change as an attack on their freedom (and it's always 'their' freedom). Policies that say 'you making small changes with X would all add up to helping with Y' are never going to be accepted by these people and while I don't think they're quite the majority, they are often the loudest person in the room.

It's clear that the changes needed won't happen until that lot are gone or are safely drooling in their chairs (not too long to go though based on some of the evidence at least). I dread to think how the youngest generation will look back on this but atleast that's nothing new.

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Mind you this one pretty angry too, he wants anyone over 25 dead. :hehe:

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Originally Posted by JamesWales

Who has asked for there to be no consequences to speeding?

The debate is about the limit.

If I say the safe driving limit on some roads should be 30, and others say 20 that doesn't mean there is dispute that people exceeding the limits shouldn't be held responsible for it. It's a dispute over the limit itself.

The invention of strawmen in debates is so frustrating, but always illuminating.

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Wait till Drakeford bans blogging, he'll be doing a 55 pager on his own, it's easy not to care when something doesn't affect you.

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Originally Posted by JamesWales

Who has asked for there to be no consequences to speeding?

The debate is about the limit.

If I say the safe driving limit on some roads should be 30, and others say 20 that doesn't mean there is dispute that people exceeding the limits shouldn't be held responsible for it. It's a dispute over the limit itself.

The invention of strawmen in debates is so frustrating, but always illuminating.

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Im making a general observation about the, Thatcherite, “I, me, mine” generation (the generation that I often feel ashamed to belong to) who are now at, or reaching, retirement age and yet they’re being pandered to at the expense of people younger than them - the furore kicked up by some about a reduction in the speed limit being symptomatic of the sense of entitlement a lot of youngsters accuse us sixty pluses of having.

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Originally Posted by North Cardiff Blue

Wait till Drakeford bans blogging, he'll be doing a 55 pager on his own, it's easy not to care when something doesn't affect you.

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:facepalm:

On balance, I’m against the 20 mph speed limit, but I’m not letting it dominate my day from the moment I wake up to the second I nod off like some others are doing.

Let's boot Labour out, construct a chamber which enforces a broad coaltion of parties .

Bring in mandatory voting for the 3.21 million voters . The current administration was elected by under 500k ffs how does that reflect democracy.

Allow the electrate to vote for AM and First Minster at the same time .

Any petition over a million has to.be acted on not just discussed.

First Ministers to be deselected if half the population in Wales petion WAG.

Or just get rid of the lot and stop the £19.5m per yesr on top of the Senedd's existing budget of £67m. Per fecking year yep per year

How many hospitals would that build or provide how many extra Teachers and Police ???

We talk about Westminster waste my god we're trying to catch up..

Hypocrisy at its best ..

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Originally Posted by life on mars

Let's boot Labour out, construct a chamber which enforces a broad coaltion of parties .

Bring in mandatory voting for the 3.21 million voters . The current administration was elected by under 500k ffs how does that reflect democracy.

Allow the electrate to vote for AM and First Minster at the same time .

Any petition over a million has to.be acted on not just discussed.

First Ministers to be deselected if half the population in Wales petion WAG.

Or just get rid of the lot and stop the £19.5m per yesr on top of the Senedd's existing budget of £67m. Per fecking year yep per year

How many hospitals would that build or provide how many extra Teachers and Police ???

We talk about Westminster waste my god we're trying to catch up..

Hypocrisy at its best ..

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Wibble?

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Originally Posted by the other bob wilson

Im making a general observation about the, Thatcherite, “I, me, mine” generation (the generation that I often feel ashamed to belong to) who are now at, or reaching, retirement age and yet they’re being pandered to at the expense of people younger than them - the furore kicked up by some about a reduction in the speed limit being symptomatic of the sense of entitlement a lot of youngsters accuse us sixty pluses of having.

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Yeah, fair point, although I'm not sure that applies here. I'm not sure those signing the petition have any relationship to Thatcherism (far higher numbers have signed it in the valleys than rural Wales for example) and I don't think it's an older generation thing either. I think older generations generally are more supportive of the 20mph thing as they perhaps have more time on their hands on a day to day basis.

I can see why people are pissed off about it tbh. People lead busy lives and any intervention that seems pointless to them is going to cause resentment

I drove through Pentwyn, Rhyd-Y-Penau Road, Fidlas Road, Station Road, Heol Hir and Templeton Avenue yesterday, all at 20 mph.

Almost nodded off twice, 20mph is dangerous !!!!!

Still going

448,485 signatures against

Decided upon on a whim, very daft this will cost Labour a lot of votes and for what?

https://petitions.senedd.wales/petit..._ghzXUbI5QtPSE

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Originally Posted by jon1959

Wibble?

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I knew I'd draw out an usual lefties intellect comment they hate democracy.

You live in Ingerlund so.not much to do with you .

Sort our yer fraudulent Sheffield Labour, and then comment .

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Originally Posted by North Cardiff Blue

Still going

448,485 signatures against

Decided upon on a whim, very daft this will cost Labour a lot of votes and for what?

https://petitions.senedd.wales/petit..._ghzXUbI5QtPSE

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It won't they'd vote Labour if they stopped serving beer here in Wales .

Brext vote proved that, all the alleged lefties who came out to vote to leave in big numbers then voted Labour in the next GE , even knowing Sir Bier was desperately to remain ..

Now there all going to vote for BlairKier Tory party FFS...

Boris was more left than Sir Bier.

You couldn't make it up.

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Originally Posted by life on mars

I knew I'd draw out an usual lefties intellect comment they hate democracy.

You live in Ingerlund so.not much to do with you .

Sort our yer fraudulent Sheffield Labour, and then comment .

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Wibble?

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Originally Posted by North Cardiff Blue

Decided upon on a whim, very daft this will cost Labour a lot of votes and for what?

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1) Not decided upon a whim at all - but an evidence based decision, that hasn't only been made here, but in a large number of other areas throughout the world.
2) I doubt tis will have any significant effect on how the votes play out here.
3) For what - to save lives!

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Originally Posted by life on mars

It won't they'd vote Labour if they stopped serving beer here in Wales .

Brext vote proved that, all the alleged lefties who came out to vote to leave in big numbers then voted Labour in the next GE , even knowing Sir Bier was desperately to remain ..

Now there all going to vote for BlairKier Tory party FFS...

Boris was more left than Sir Bier.

You couldn't make it up.

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Kier has a brain though.

Unlike the Tory Loons in Govt. 🤣🤣🤣

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Originally Posted by jon1959

Wibble?

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TBG is a bit of a Linguist, Although he'd have to live Ten lifetimes even before he could get to grips with 'Key Stage 1' LOM-Glish.

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Originally Posted by life on mars

Bring in mandatory voting for the 3.21 million voters . The current administration was elected by under 500k ffs how does that reflect democracy.

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Now this is something regardless of political opinions and agendas I would happily back. Some of the turnouts for elections in Wales have been pathetic.

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Originally Posted by Hilts

Kier has a brain though.

Unlike the Tory Loons in Govt. 🤣🤣🤣

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:hehe::hehe:

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Originally Posted by Der Kaiser

Now this is something regardless of political opinions and agendas I would happily back. Some of the turnouts for elections in Wales have been pathetic.

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Why. ?I dont think ive ever voted in a Senedd election.

Why should I have to vote for any of them.?

I admit I would turn out if I thought there was the slightest chance of a Tory tw@t getting in. But that would just be #anyone but the Tories.

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Originally Posted by Hilts

Why. ?I dont think ive ever voted in a Senedd election.

Why should I have to vote for any of them.?

I admit I would turn out if I thought there was the slightest chance of a Tory tw@t getting in. But that would just be #anyone but the Tories.

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Because it's embarrassing Wales is a democratically elected country with less than 40% of population consistently turning up to the polls.



Edit: For what it's worth, they could make it like the Australian system which I understand has an option to vote for nobody on the ballot paper, but you have to go. It makes people interested and gets them involved in political conversation if they have to or get fined.

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Originally Posted by Rjk

1) Not decided upon a whim at all - but an evidence based decision, that hasn't only been made here, but in a large number of other areas throughout the world.
2) I doubt tis will have any significant effect on how the votes play out here.
3) For what - to save lives!

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A whim, even you agreed the money could have been better used elsewhere everyone agreed that.

It could cost them in Westminster, the Red Blue Red walls are turning blue again, wouldn't it be crazy if the only thing stopping Labour was Drippys disaster alerting them of the desire to ban the car early :hehe:

I would have bet anything on Newer Labour (same policies as Conservatives except earlier unpopular green measures) getting elected with a landslide, but now Drippy and Khans policies are frightening voters off, it could get a lot closer.

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Originally Posted by Der Kaiser

Because it's embarrassing Wales is a democratically elected country with less than 40% of population consistently turning up to the polls.



Edit: For what it's worth, they could make it like the Australian system which I understand has an option to vote for nobody on the ballot paper, but you have to go. It makes people interested and gets them involved in political conversation if they have to or get fined.

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Can't we have a vote to reverse the devolution and sack them all?

Leave would probably win this one!

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Originally Posted by BLUETIT

I drove through Pentwyn, Rhyd-Y-Penau Road, Fidlas Road, Station Road, Heol Hir and Templeton Avenue yesterday, all at 20 mph.

Almost nodded off twice, 20mph is dangerous !!!!!

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You need to get down to allensbank rd, it’s another level of slow with the new cycle lanes and lights that you can never get through as there are no filters, you could easily get a 5 minute power knap…..:thumbup:

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Originally Posted by Hilts

Kier has a brain though.

Unlike the Tory Loons in Govt. 🤣🤣🤣

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But he’s just another Tory or very posh slightly lefty

What has the current government in Wales done to promote tourism in the last two years , considering it’s around 12% employment and 5% GDP ?

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Originally Posted by North Cardiff Blue

Can't we have a vote to reverse the devolution and sack them all?

Leave would probably win this one!

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You would like to go back to the days when Wales was ruled by a Secretary of State (who acted like a governor of a Roman Provence). More often than not it was an English Tory who used it to promote himself at the expense of Wales.

Who can forget John Redwood pretend to sing the Welsh national anthem, looking like Mr Bean.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WFP5MjUuzsg

You have frequently gone on about democracy, but was is more democratic, politicians elected by the citizens of Wales or a political ruler imposed by a Westminster government elected mostly by English voters?

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Originally Posted by TWGL1

What has the current government in Wales done to promote tourism in the last two years , considering it’s around 12% employment and 5% GDP ?

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Trying to kill it off by the looks, lots of holiday let’s selling up as they know they can’t let for the insane 182 days a year, it’s 70 days in England like it used to be here. Tourist tax too….

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Originally Posted by JamesWales

Just a smidge of an escalation?

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700+ post thread about driving a little bit slower.

To be fair though I have learnt that some people have found that having to drive a bit slower will make your journey a little bit longer so it wasn't all hot air in here.

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Originally Posted by goats

Trying to kill it off by the looks, lots of holiday let’s selling up as they know they can’t let for the insane 182 days a year, it’s 70 days in England like it used to be here. Tourist tax too….

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How many people, when considering where to go on their summer holiday, dismiss a potential destination because they'd have to pay a tourist tax?

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Originally Posted by goats

But he’s just another Tory or very posh slightly lefty

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He was the civil rights lawyer who sued the government to demand that all illegal immigrants should get full benefits, which is now costing the government billions.
I hope he is proud of himself.
The same man who has a special government approved pension which means he can put as much as he wants into it while other people can't.
The same man who was head of the public prosecutions office that failed to charge the sex rings in places like Bradford because it might be seen as racist.
The same man who failed to charge Jimmy Saville.
The same man who sat on the front bench with Jeremy Corbyn before he stabbed him in the back.
The same man who fought tooth and nail in the commons to try to prevent the voted will of the people to leave the EU. Attempting to overturn a perfectly legal democratic vote.
The same man who told the world that his father worked in a factory but conveniently forget to mention that he owned the factory.

etc. etc........

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Originally Posted by TWGL1

What has the current government in Wales done to promote tourism in the last two years , considering it’s around 12% employment and 5% GDP ?

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They've lowered the speed in Wales on the motorway so it will take ages for visitors ages to get here.
They've decided not to build any new roads so it will take ages to get here.
They've scrapped the brynglas tunnel M4 Motorway by pass so it will take ages to get here.
They've lowered the speed in residential areas, so unfamiliar visitors risk speeding points and £100 fines.
They've tripled the council tax for 2nd homes, so the cost for Airbnb will have to go up to pay for it, and many are selling up.
They've proposed a tourist tax.

You could say they've done wonders for the tourism industry

In Cornwall and Devon.

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Originally Posted by 79blue

You would like to go back to the days when Wales was ruled by a Secretary of State (who acted like a governor of a Roman Provence). More often than not it was an English Tory who used it to promote himself at the expense of Wales.

Who can forget John Redwood pretend to sing the Welsh national anthem, looking like Mr Bean.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WFP5MjUuzsg

You have frequently gone on about democracy, but was is more democratic, politicians elected by the citizens of Wales or a political ruler imposed by a Westminster government elected mostly by English voters?

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Yes please anything has got to be better than what we have!

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Originally Posted by xsnaggle

He was the civil rights lawyer who sued the government to demand that all illegal immigrants should get full benefits, which is now costing the government billions.
I hope he is proud of himself.
The same man who has a special government approved pension which means he can put as much as he wants into it while other people can't.
The same man who was head of the public prosecutions office that failed to charge the sex rings in places like Bradford because it might be seen as racist.
The same man who failed to charge Jimmy Saville.
The same man who sat on the front bench with Jeremy Corbyn before he stabbed him in the back.
The same man who fought tooth and nail in the commons to try to prevent the voted will of the people to leave the EU. Attempting to overturn a perfectly legal democratic vote.
The same man who told the world that his father worked in a factory but conveniently forget to mention that he owned the factory.

etc. etc........

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Perhaps you need to bone up on Starmer on things such as the awful Saville affair. I’m not a massive fan of him but false accusations are a bit out of order.

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Originally Posted by xsnaggle

He was the civil rights lawyer who sued the government to demand that all illegal immigrants should get full benefits, which is now costing the government billions.
I hope he is proud of himself.
The same man who has a special government approved pension which means he can put as much as he wants into it while other people can't.
The same man who was head of the public prosecutions office that failed to charge the sex rings in places like Bradford because it might be seen as racist.
The same man who failed to charge Jimmy Saville.
The same man who sat on the front bench with Jeremy Corbyn before he stabbed him in the back.
The same man who fought tooth and nail in the commons to try to prevent the voted will of the people to leave the EU. Attempting to overturn a perfectly legal democratic vote.
The same man who told the world that his father worked in a factory but conveniently forget to mention that he owned the factory.

etc. etc........

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What a load of lying crap.

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Originally Posted by xsnaggle

He was the civil rights lawyer who sued the government to demand that all illegal immigrants should get full benefits, which is now costing the government billions.
I hope he is proud of himself.
The same man who has a special government approved pension which means he can put as much as he wants into it while other people can't.
The same man who was head of the public prosecutions office that failed to charge the sex rings in places like Bradford because it might be seen as racist.
The same man who failed to charge Jimmy Saville.
The same man who sat on the front bench with Jeremy Corbyn before he stabbed him in the back.
The same man who fought tooth and nail in the commons to try to prevent the voted will of the people to leave the EU. Attempting to overturn a perfectly legal democratic vote.
The same man who told the world that his father worked in a factory but conveniently forget to mention that he owned the factory.

etc. etc........

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WTF?

This site has gone to shit with posts like this.