Welsh Elections 2021 poll

[Rjk]

Re: Welsh Elections 2021 poll

It wouldn't surprise me to see Tories do well (labour fatigue, Tory MP's in North Wales from last Westminster elections but actually vote increase larger in the south) but, imo, I can't see what they have done to deserve it.

Regarding M4 relief road, if it does get made you almost instantly have to thing about a second relief road and that's only going to cause greater damage to the environment. Meanwhile, floods in Wales get worse.

Regarding Covid, ignoring the fire-breal idea, delay of lockdown in England, schools going back for one day all contributed to more sustained level of grief under a Tory government this winter.

In the big event of the year (covid) and big event of the next 10 years (climate change) Tories haven't stood up well.

the relief road project would have sucked up all of the Welsh governments infrastructure spending capabilities for a long time and not actually delivered much tangible benefit.
I think it was estimated to generate an extra £25 million a year. for the cost it was extremely not worth it.
"environmental concerns" is a red herring - if it had paid for itself in 2 years it would have definitely been done. it was going to take like 30 years to pay back - so it got shelved.

I can't believe the conservatives would have approached it any differently. it would be an extremely un-tory way of doing things.

[surge]

Re: Welsh Elections 2021 poll

What are the benefits in voting Tories or abolishing ?

It will surely make anyone living in Wales worse off, won't it ?

I'm not a labour person, but Drakeford has done fine.

Plaid will endeavour to make the country that you live in more prosperous.....regardless of whether you are a "unionist" or a left-wing, post-colonial "nationalist". I vote Plaid but consider myself pro-independence and pro-immigration as opposed to a nationalist. I would also consider it imperative for our country to maintain close ties with England. But it is also essential for us to manage our on affairs in order for us to progress. I'm certain of this. We will be an after-thought within the union....and that is just a matter of numbers, nothing more. We only represent about 4% of the votership and GDP when lumped in with the rest of the countries in the UK. It's clear that we have little say and as such, can always be overlooked.

If you felt Wales was rarely taken seriously at Westminster level before (and only supported when it could be made a cross border issue) then just wait til our representation in UK government drops after next round of elections.

Those wanting to abolish Senedd presumably want the attention, and to express frustration with Senedd, but can't see how damaging it will be in less than 5 years time.

[City123]

Re: Welsh Elections 2021 poll

If you felt Wales was rarely taken seriously at Westminster level before (and only supported when it could be made a cross border issue) then just wait til our representation in UK government drops after next round of elections.

Those wanting to abolish Senedd presumably want the attention, and to express frustration with Senedd, but can't see how damaging it will be in less than 5 years time.

I don't see Abolish as a real threat to be honest. There's very little appetite for abolishing the Senedd amongst under 50s (indeed polling shows that independence is more popular than abolishing the Senedd). We're now seeing people who've grown up knowing nothing but the Senedd coming to vote so I think the calls for abolishment will decrease in the coming years

[cityhammer]

Re: Welsh Elections 2021 poll

I honestly don't believe that the Welsh Tories would have pushed the M4 relief road through either. the project made no sense financially. unless the firm's that were doing it were large Tory donors I can't see them having the appetite for it.

On what basis did it not make sense financially?

[Rjk]

Re: Welsh Elections 2021 poll

On what basis did it not make sense financially?

it was already to forecast more than 1bn quid and the estimates were being rapidly revised upwards.
the impact study suggested that building it would generate an extra £25 million a year in the Welsh economy or something like that. that would take 40 years to pay back the investment l. there have to be things that we can invest in that will have a better return for Wales than that.
if the shoe was on the other foot the Tories would have shot it down too for that reason, and also pretended it was for environmental concerns.
in 40 years we'll probably travel everywhere in tubes or something making the whole exercise completely pointless anyway.

[surge]

Re: Welsh Elections 2021 poll

it was already to forecast more than 1bn quid and the estimates were being rapidly revised upwards.
the impact study suggested that building it would generate an extra £25 million a year in the Welsh economy or something like that. that would take 40 years to pay back the investment l. there have to be things that we can invest in that will have a better return for Wales than that.
if the shoe was on the other foot the Tories would have shot it down too for that reason, and also pretended it was for environmental concerns.
in 40 years we'll probably travel everywhere in tubes or something making the whole exercise completely pointless anyway.

Or underwater roads which, if designed by Tories, conveniently miss out Wales.

[life on mars]

Re: Welsh Elections 2021 poll

I'm amazed by the results so far of that poll given the abuse anyone who has voted Tory has got on here.

Speaks volumes perhaps folk would feel bullied for having a different view and don't want to run the risk of abuse as they want to remain part of this message board.

When people type their vile responses they should consider who they are effecting, some may suffer from depression or anxiety and dont deserve the abuse for having a view .

[WJ99mobile]

Re: Welsh Elections 2021 poll

I don't see Abolish as a real threat to be honest. There's very little appetite for abolishing the Senedd amongst under 50s (indeed polling shows that independence is more popular than abolishing the Senedd). We're now seeing people who've grown up knowing nothing but the Senedd coming to vote so I think the calls for abolishment will decrease in the coming years

I do understand the frustration with the senedd as they're unable to legislate on the big topics such as immigration, policing and various laws so end up discussing secondary issues. I think people look at the numbers of assembly members there are, on quite a sizeable wage for what is seemingly minimal work with a lot of talking and not a lot of action.

I again recognise my own hypocrisy for not wanting a independent Wales to which would grant said powers but I do feel an independent Wales would be such a massive risk economically that I just don't want to test the waters.

However I do agree we will need a Senedd more than ever over the next few years.

[life on mars]

Re: Welsh Elections 2021 poll

I do understand the frustration with the senedd as they're unable to legislate on the big topics such as immigration, policing and various laws so end up discussing secondary issues. I think people look at the numbers of assembly members there are, on quite a sizeable wage for what is seemingly minimal work with a lot of talking and not a lot of action.

I again recognise my own hypocrisy for not wanting a independent Wales to which would grant said powers but I do feel an independent Wales would be such a massive risk economically that I just don't want to test the waters.

However I do agree we will need a Senedd more than ever over the next few years.

Id like a Senedd not dictated by a single party politics as its divisive to our nation

[City123]

Re: Welsh Elections 2021 poll

I do understand the frustration with the senedd as they're unable to legislate on the big topics such as immigration, policing and various laws so end up discussing secondary issues. I think people look at the numbers of assembly members there are, on quite a sizeable wage for what is seemingly minimal work with a lot of talking and not a lot of action.

I again recognise my own hypocrisy for not wanting a independent Wales to which would grant said powers but I do feel an independent Wales would be such a massive risk economically that I just don't want to test the waters.

However I do agree we will need a Senedd more than ever over the next few years.

We've seen increased pressure on devolution recently as I think there may be a feeling that time is running out on abolishing the Senedd and Holyrood especially. Younger people are in favour of the Senedd and more powers, the numbers supporting that are only likely to increase as more people who've grown up with it come of voting age

The issue with the Senedd is the Labour Party. Wales is pretty much a one party nation and has been for almost a century, that kind of dominance is bad for any country, the most desirable likely outcome for me is a Lab-Plaid coalition with a fairly even split minister wise.

[Hilts]

Re: Welsh Elections 2021 poll

Speaks volumes perhaps folk would feel bullied for having a different view and don't want to run the risk of abuse as they want to remain part of this message board.

When people type their vile responses they should consider who they are effecting, some may suffer from depression or anxiety and dont deserve the abuse for having a view .

Ive seen posters on here describing certain posters as lefties. Dont think they feel bullied though.

Saying that I dont look at the politics thread.

[surge]

Re: Welsh Elections 2021 poll

I do understand the frustration with the senedd as they're unable to legislate on the big topics such as immigration, policing and various laws so end up discussing secondary issues. I think people look at the numbers of assembly members there are, on quite a sizeable wage for what is seemingly minimal work with a lot of talking and not a lot of action.

I again recognise my own hypocrisy for not wanting a independent Wales to which would grant said powers but I do feel an independent Wales would be such a massive risk economically that I just don't want to test the waters.

However I do agree we will need a Senedd more than ever over the next few years.

There was recognition that Westminster needed to retain MPs because of the extra work caused by Brexit. I'd argue more numbers needed in Senedd rather than less for the same reason especially with reduction in Welsh MPs and I think Andrew RT Davies agrees considering he wants a specific post for covid response. Issue is who goes forward for selection, who gets voted in and how they behave afterwards. There are good people to vote for in Wales but ills with voting for Mark Reckless (too drunk to vote on a budget) because one is sick of the Senedd as there is issue with voting anyone just because they're Labour.

[Wozza16]

Re: Welsh Elections 2021 poll

I never understand why people would want to abolish the Senedd, they are often the brexit voters who were crying at the thought of another vote 'crushing democracy'. All the votes in Wales since the late 90s have been in favour of the Senedd or for more voting powers so growing Tory preference on abolishing the Senedd is the most hypocritical opinion I've heard for a long time, how abolish get so much air time is beyond me.

I think Wales should and needs to be either have fully devolved powers or independence, I've lived in many commonwealth countries and to see their growth and opinions as independent countries has made me realise what Wales could achieve. I grew up in south Wales in the 90s and looking back I feel like it was a lot more grim of a place than it is now (up until I left in 2018), if Wales and the population wasn't such a pushover then Wales could get so much more done.

How after 500 years of being in the "greatest" union the world has seen do we have massive poverty areas and some of the poorest areas in Europe while 200 miles away is some of the richest? All while having massive deposits of slate, copper, coal and now renewable potential.

Welsh people fixate on issues and don't look at the wider picture (mainly because of a English based media) I see people suggesting to get rid of the Senedd and invest the money in NHS, schools etc. The Senedd costs 50 million, that's peanuts in the grand scheme of things and do you really think if it disappeared the Torys would then go, here's your 50 million? No chance. It would stop the legal minimum amounts of spending to be ripped up and Wales would get even less money than it has now.

We're already missing out on £5 BILLION because of HS2 being an England and Wales project, WTF, not 1 inch of it is in Wales and it's blown out 3x the initial estimate and been proven to damage the Welsh economy by hundreds of millions of pounds, but here we are with people talking of voting for the Tories! That is why in my opinion Wales has always struggled and will continue to do so, until people see the wood for the trees.

[stevebrickman]

Re: Welsh Elections 2021 poll

what is the rubbish that Drakeford has done?

which Tories in Wales have impressed you?

Joel Williams. Currently councillor for Pontprennau and St Mellons. He’s young, but impressive. He’s running for Cardiff North in the assembly elections I believe. Think he will go far.

[City123]

Re: Welsh Elections 2021 poll

A lot of Plaid placards up in Cardiff West, I spoke to someone in the party and its over 160 there already compared to just 80 last time. A lot of polls have put Cardiff West as switching to Plaid based on uniform swing but I can't see it, but the amount of placards up suggests they may do well.

In my view, Plaid are the real threat to Labour, not the Conservatives. The places where Welsh national identity is strongest are all in the Valleys and if Plaid can tap into that then Labour are in real trouble.