Is this where Farage could surprise Labour, Conservatives and pollsters?

[the other bob wilson]

I think you can appreciate the nuance on how different people define things Jon given you have consistently defended various chants etc and a certain leader that many have called racist.

I think the reality is this is a deflection, and it's gone on from years. This isn't the 70s. This isnt the era of windrush. Immigration now sees about a decades worth of people arrive in a year.

And none of you explain how we deal with that, and use slurs as a defence mechanism for that.

It doesn't work.

“He was a deeply unembarrassed racist” and you talk about nuance!

Leaving arguments about racism to one side though, why is drivel like this not getting the attention it should get from a media that acts as if they are in awe of the con man?

https://x.com/Nigel_Farage/status/15...791168?lang=en

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

“He was a deeply unembarrassed racist” and you talk about nuance!

Leaving arguments about racism to one side though, why is drivel like this not getting the attention it should get from a media that acts as if they are in awe of the con man?

https://x.com/Nigel_Farage/status/15...791168?lang=en

That's not working for me bob

[Dorcus]

Froggy has a cheek to point his finger at immigrants, he being a Huguenot himself! Sounds a familiar story with the likes of Ben Habib, Patel and Braverman..."we've made it to the promised land purely by luck, now we'll close up the drawbridge to the wretches"

[the other bob wilson]

That's not working for me bob

It was a reaction tweet by Farage to the Truss/Kwarteng budget saying it was the best one since 1986.

[jon1959]

It was a reaction tweet by Farage to the Truss/Kwarteng budget saying it was the best one since 1986.

The picture below of Farage gurning on a gilded throne alongside Donald Trump (also gurning on a gilded throne) was of a piece with the tweet.

Sums up the racist con artist perfectly. (Sorry - shouldn't have said that - James will be fuming! )

[JamesWales]

The picture below of Farage gurning on a gilded throne alongside Donald Trump (also gurning on a gilded throne) was of a piece with the tweet.

Sums up the racist con artist perfectly. (Sorry - shouldn't have said that - James will be fuming! )

Not fuming, I just think it shows a weakness on the left that it's all you've gone in response to record levels of immigration. And a tad ironic when you have championed someone who has also received the same accusations of racism from the media and their detractors.

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Froggy has a cheek to point his finger at immigrants, he being a Huguenot himself! Sounds a familiar story with the likes of Ben Habib, Patel and Braverman..."we've made it to the promised land purely by luck, now we'll close up the drawbridge to the wretches"

I can't be doing with braverman and Patel outlining their ethnic credentials then saying how bad all these immigrants are for the country

I think they must be doing it to get on the right side of the nutters but they will suffer the same fate should the swivel eyed crew ever get in

[JamesWales]

I can't be doing with braverman and Patel outlining their ethnic credentials then saying how bad all these immigrants are for the country

I think they must be doing it to get on the right side of the nutters but they will suffer the same fate should the swivel eyed crew ever get in

So because someone was born to parents with non white skin colour, she is forbidden from expressing any concerns over immigration? She has to support a completely unlimited number?

Bit racist of you Sludge, to use her race to determine how she should and shouldn't think?

[jon1959]

Not fuming, I just think it shows a weakness on the left that it's all you've gone in response to record levels of immigration. And a tad ironic when you have championed someone who has also received the same accusations of racism from the media and their detractors.

It is nothing to do with record levels of immigration - all to do with the character and beliefs of Nigel Farage.

And I don't see the irony. In my opinion (based on everything I have read and heard) Farage is a racist, and Corbyn is not an anti semite.

Different cases, different evidence and different judgements. That is just my informed opinion. You have another opinion. It happens.

I do agree that immigration, changes to population, demands on public services and housing, and everything else related to those questions should be debated - and it is an important issue in the election. I don't think that the necessary information about social and economic costs and benefits has been put out there. The contributions (skills, taxes, jobs) seem to be missing whilst the demands on services and homes is put in lights. I have little sympathy for conservative angst about cultural change, but I agree that as a society we need to understand and take a position on how or if we should absorb high levels of net immigration. To do that we need to get under the headline figures.

We are a rich country with massive inequalities of wealth and life opportunities. We can afford to build more houses and hospitals if we need them, but governments and their supporters have different priorities and make different choices.

Of course there are other parts to the picture too. If all our criminal (Sext Beast) pensioners who have decamped to Spain were made to come home and depend on the NHS it would break the system even more! I wonder if Farage supports 0% emigration as well as 0% immigration?

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

So because someone was born to parents with non white skin colour, she is forbidden from expressing any concerns over immigration? She has to support a completely unlimited number?

Bit racist of you Sludge, to use her race to determine how she should and shouldn't think?

I couldn't care less , she's benefitted from immigration now she wants if stopped

Fck her

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

It is nothing to do with record levels of immigration - all to do with the character and beliefs of Nigel Farage.

And I don't see the irony. In my opinion (based on everything I have read and heard) Farage is a racist, and Corbyn is not an anti semite.

Different cases, different evidence and different judgements. That is just my informed opinion. You have another opinion. It happens.

I do agree that immigration, changes to population, demands on public services and housing, and everything else related to those questions should be debated - and it is an important issue in the election. I don't think that the necessary information about social and economic costs and benefits has been put out there. The contributions (skills, taxes, jobs) seem to be missing whilst the demands on services and homes is put in lights. I have little sympathy for conservative angst about cultural change, but I agree that as a society we need to understand and take a position on how or if we should absorb high levels of net immigration. To do that we need to get under the headline figures.

We are a rich country with massive inequalities of wealth and life opportunities. We can afford to build more houses and hospitals if we need them, but governments and their supporters have different priorities and make different choices.

Of course there are other parts to the picture too. If all our criminal (Sext Beast) pensioners who have decamped to Spain were made to come home and depend on the NHS it would break the system even more! I wonder if Farage supports 0% emigration as well as 0% immigration?

I really don't know why you bother debating with this farage supporting wannabee

He's becoming a swivel head as his beloved tory party sinks

[JamesWales]

I couldn't care less , she's benefitted from immigration now she wants if stopped

Fck her

That's like saying she benefitted from going to school and now she objects to class sizes of 35 kids

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

That's like saying she benefitted from going to school and now she objects to class sizes of 35 kids

No it isn't at all

Here you are defending the racist farage saying he's not a racist

And the goose stepping braverman who is rightfully castigated for her extreme views

You carry on , it's creepy

I can't be doing with this cobblers

I am off

[JamesWales]

It is nothing to do with record levels of immigration - all to do with the character and beliefs of Nigel Farage.

And I don't see the irony. In my opinion (based on everything I have read and heard) Farage is a racist, and Corbyn is not an anti semite.

Different cases, different evidence and different judgements. That is just my informed opinion. You have another opinion. It happens.

I do agree that immigration, changes to population, demands on public services and housing, and everything else related to those questions should be debated - and it is an important issue in the election. I don't think that the necessary information about social and economic costs and benefits has been put out there. The contributions (skills, taxes, jobs) seem to be missing whilst the demands on services and homes is put in lights. I have little sympathy for conservative angst about cultural change, but I agree that as a society we need to understand and take a position on how or if we should absorb high levels of net immigration. To do that we need to get under the headline figures.

We are a rich country with massive inequalities of wealth and life opportunities. We can afford to build more houses and hospitals if we need them, but governments and their supporters have different priorities and make different choices.

Of course there are other parts to the picture too. If all our criminal (Sext Beast) pensioners who have decamped to Spain were made to come home and depend on the NHS it would break the system even more! I wonder if Farage supports 0% emigration as well as 0% immigration?

For what it's worth I think neither Corbyn or Farage are racist. It is effectively illegal to be so. Both could and would have been arrested. I do think both flirt with the idea and both get caught up in two common contemporary mistruths; that being concerned about high immigration is racist and that criticising Israel is antisemitic. Neither are true. In both cases I think they can be a little guilty of turning a blind eye too, and associating themselves at times with people they shouldnt.

But fundamentally, the topic raised is critical to our country, particularly those at the poorer end of the spectrum who typically compete in terms of housing, jobs and even cultural space. The wealthier typically benefit more from high immigration, increased demand being great for landlords or business owners for example.

I do generally think the left have dropped a bollock on this and we've seen that across the world really. I think Labour will learn pretty sharpish how key sustainable migration is to service delivery and community cohesion etc. I really hope so, or else people will likely look elsewhere.

[JamesWales]

No it isn't at all

Here you are defending the racist farage saying he's not a racist

And the goose stepping braverman who is rightfully castigated for her extreme views

You carry on , it's creepy

I can't be doing with this cobblers

I am off

Farage is a racist. Braverman is a nazi. You don't answer the question or put forward any actual ideas.

It's like your entire CCMB input boiled down into one post.

[stevo]

Not fuming, I just think it shows a weakness on the left that it's all you've gone in response to record levels of immigration. And a tad ironic when you have championed someone who has also received the same accusations of racism from the media and their detractors.

There’s a difference between being concerned about immigration (e.g. you) and being racist (e.g. Farage).

[cyril evans awaydays]

For what it's worth I think neither Corbyn or Farage are racist. It is effectively illegal to be so. Both could and would have been arrested. I do think both flirt with the idea and both get caught up in two common contemporary mistruths; that being concerned about high immigration is racist and that criticising Israel is antisemitic. Neither are true. In both cases I think they can be a little guilty of turning a blind eye too, and associating themselves at times with people they shouldnt.

But fundamentally, the topic raised is critical to our country, particularly those at the poorer end of the spectrum who typically compete in terms of housing, jobs and even cultural space. The wealthier typically benefit more from high immigration, increased demand being great for landlords or business owners for example.

I do generally think the left have dropped a bollock on this and we've seen that across the world really. I think Labour will learn pretty sharpish how key sustainable migration is to service delivery and community cohesion etc. I really hope so, or else people will likely look elsewhere.

We are now eight years on from a referendum and four years on since a treaty got Brexit done. Boat immigration is a sliver of the record overall immigration levels since we "took back control".

Some cynics would argue that the new elite proposing "Global Britain" just wanted to channel an anti-immigration working class sentiment to further their deregulation ambitions. So changing an immigration dynamic from the East Europeans picking our fruit and mending our pipes to the multitude of nationalities that run our care homes and an explosion of foreign students was a reasonable price to pay.

As long as small state budgets like Truss's were possible outside the economic strictures of the EU. What could possibly go wrong?

[stevo]

I won’t have a word said against Brexit. It’s going to save the NHS, remember? In Farage we trust!

[Dorcus]

I won’t have a word said against Brexit. It’s going to save the NHS, remember? In Farage we trust!

A heavily funded exercise in utilising the stupidity and illogical conviction of the non cerebral masses to overturn common sense by the unbridled power of sheer shock propaganda to drive democratic will.

[Hilts]

It's desperate stuff. Highlighting the benefits of immigration to the wealthy but ignoring the benefits to the less so.

As well as the loonies on the right. Make no doubt they are definitely targeting working class people with the anti immigrant agenda.

[JamesWales]

A heavily funded exercise in utilising the stupidity and illogical conviction of the non cerebral masses to overturn common sense by the unbridled power of sheer shock propaganda to drive democratic will.

Given that you are prone to calling people stupid, perhaps you can confirm how many billions more are in the NHS budget now than in 2016?

[JamesWales]

Given that you are prone to calling people stupid, perhaps you can confirm how many billions more are in the NHS budget now than in 2016?

You deflected to answer this Dorcus!

The answer is that the total NHS and social care budget has gone from £143.1bn at the time of the referendum to £185.4bn in 2022/23.

That's an increase of £42.3bn a year, or more than £800m a week, well, well in excess of £350m a week even allowing for recent inflation

https://www.kingsfund.org.uk/insight...udget-nutshell