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I do like you sometimes.Originally Posted by jon1959
Trump avoids answering their question but to assume he had no appropriate answer is simply speculation.
I've just put a number of points to jon1959 and he has avoided them. While I may think he like Trump is out of his depth, I can't declare that dogmatically because I cannot know that for certain. He has his chance to surprise us all and be untrump-like
But as you brought it up, how would you explain the process of being 'born-again' from a Biblical perspective?
From another post it seems you intended this to be taken seriously. So here you go:
That's your lot though. No more time to waste on what you laughingly think of as a debate!As usual, a rant with no substance.
You don't wish to examine the credibility of those scientists.
I have watched too many of the clips you have put up. And followed other so-called debates of a similar type. Most of those scientists that you promote fall back on either 'an intelligent design' theory in place of the current best theory of evolution or peddle a bizarre argument that the chances of humanity and the world getting to the exact place we find ourselves are so infinitesimally unlikely that it couldn't have happened. Both lines of thought are so badly flawed it should be self-evident. Both start from a conclusion (one you like) and try to work back from there to create an argument. The improbability line (with no thanks to Douglas Adams I note) turns logic on its head. We are where we are because of things that have happened before. They 100% happened so the likelihood of us being here and now is 100%. No amount of brain scrambling, no amount of unashamed illogic, no amount of deferment to supernatural/invented alternate explanations should be given the time of day.
You do want to assume that all those who know Christ personally are uneducated.
I have never said that. But education is no guaranteed defence against stupidity.
You can't nail down even one so called inconsistency!
I nailed down two for you: faith or science; real Christians v claiming anyone whose grandmother held a rosary. Can you not read, or is it just understanding that you struggle with?
You don't know what a cultist is or why I am not one.
I certainly do and you certainly are!
You still see people who trust the Bible as following their own faith and not the Lord Jesus Christ of the Bible?
I have no idea what that is supposed to mean. I don't speak your language or have my mind wired the way yours is - but I do think that people who believe in the literal truth of the bible (although in fact you cherry pick and dodge some of the most ridiculous or offensive bits) are deluded - in need of sympathy as well as derision.
Apart from all these, you are right on the money
What lightweight attempt at serious dialogue is this> "faith or science; real Christians v claiming anyone whose grandmother held a rosary" - if that's the level of your understanding and/ or engagement then I'd rather spend my time engaging those held by the Watchtower.
I have sufficient discussions with those who are brave enough and wise enough to engage people with respect, who deserve to have my time more than people who are too lazy to form a world view, have no foundation, no idea and therefore no hope.
Good grief - you really do have a problem with joined up thinking, don't you.
I was not offering you 'serious dialogue', I was pointing out two examples of your inherent contradictions that I had already given you, but you were unable to recognise. Why - who knows. Who cares?
You live in a closed space of circular arguments, language that loses all meaning as it constantly refers back to a book of parables and fables as if they were historical fact (talking snakes, 1000 year old Noah and all the rest that you take literally!) and deep confusion.
In the middle of all that you have ignored the examples of contradiction I have given you. If you are too frit to engage with those, why do you expect me to engage with you - any more than I (unfortunately) have done already?
If you promise to take your infantile nonsense somewhere else, to people who 'deserve to have (your) time' then great. Their suffering will be vast, but it will save me (and presumably others on this board) from your incontinent, lame-brained, gibberish. Result!
Good post Jon.Good grief - you really do have a problem with joined up thinking, don't you.
I was not offering you 'serious dialogue', I was pointing out two examples of your inherent contradictions that I had already given you, but you were unable to recognise. Why - who knows. Who cares?
You live in a closed space of circular arguments, language that loses all meaning as it constantly refers back to a book of parables and fables as if they were historical fact (talking snakes, 1000 year old Noah and all the rest that you take literally!) and deep confusion.
In the middle of all that you have ignored the examples of contradiction I have given you. If you are too frit to engage with those, why do you expect me to engage with you - any more than I (unfortunately) have done already?
If you promise to take your infantile nonsense somewhere else, to people who 'deserve to have (your) time' then great. Their suffering will be vast, but it will save me (and presumably others on this board) from your incontinent, lame-brained, gibberish. Result!
Indeed, stay within your limits
What are you hoping to get out of all this, truthpaste? If you think you're convincing or converting anyone, I promise you that is not happening.
Firstly converting has little to do with convincing. People deal directly with God, they don't repent because a mate or contact has proved them wrong.
Secondly what is or isn't happening in people's minds is only known by God, unless you are also omniscient?
If you are, then I suggest you start a new thread with all tomorrows final scores.
90%, and I'm being generous to you there, of the replies to your posts are people vehemently disagreeing with you and arguing back. I can't think of any other poster who gets less backup!
You don't need to be a mindreader, but maybe a bit more awareness would help.
I think 90% is rather generous, but I agree with your observations. In 2024 far less than 5% of people (in the UK) would agree with me; which would marry with your 'gets less backup' comment.
Primarily I'm not here for a pat on the back or warm friendship, wecome though it may be when it turns up, I'm just here to ask questions and share God's Word in a world that is desperately looking for answers and very often in denial about their success in gaining those answers.
Along the way, this is what Jesus said I (and others like me) should expect:-
“If the world hates you, remember that it hated me first. The world would love you as one of its own if you belonged to it, but you are no longer part of the world. I chose you to come out of the world, so it hates you. Do you remember what I told you? ‘A slave is not greater than the master.’ Since they persecuted me, naturally they will persecute you. And if they had listened to me, they would listen to you" - John 15:18-20
Another from the book of fables.
To be honest you're doing a terrible job of sharing God's word, you're giving Christians a bad name if anything
Spot on Jon, and I know how you feel!Good grief Lardy & Cyril - you really do have a problem with joined up thinking, don't you.
I was not offering you 'serious dialogue', I was pointing out two examples of your inherent contradictions that I had already given you, but you were unable to recognise. Why - who knows. Who cares?
You live in a closed space of circular arguments, language that loses all meaning as it constantly refers back to the Steele dossier as if it were historical fact (talking Russia collusion and all the rest that you take literally!) and deep confusion.
In the middle of all that you have ignored the examples of contradiction I have given you. If you are too frit to engage with those, why do you expect me to engage with you - any more than I (unfortunately) have done already?
If you promise to take your infantile nonsense somewhere else, to people who 'deserve to have (your) time' then great. Their suffering will be vast, but it will save me (and presumably others on this board) from your incontinent, lame-brained, gibberish. Result!
So why does the performance of Christians even make it to your radar?
I feel no desire to assess the performance of those engaged in gardening tips, party political comments or the history of CCFC?
Also, would a Christian who didn't believe the Bible give Christians a good name in your view?
How could you be a christian and not believe in the bible?
Sadly more than 50% of UK Churches could demonstrate that to you before lunchtime tomorrow by what they teach; but as you may already know, they would only be Christians based on their own traditions, and NOT the Bible. Therefore no more Christian than your typical brit.
However your point is well made, so a clearer/ better way of framing my last question would be:
Also, would a Christian who didn't adhere to the Bible give Christians a good name in your view?
Well the bible is written by man not gods words,so there so many contidictions and made up stories.
It can not be taken as the truth.
Nobody who has read it carefully would ever say that, but I understand your reasons for wanting it to be all stories.
Because I know other Christians and I've got a mental league table of you. You do well on relentlessness but arrogance and a superiority complex keeps you at the bottom
Well if God has a day off on judgement day and asks you to step in then I'll obviousy have a problem. I would say that among the contacts I have (that believe the Bible) there are very few that are willing to dive into an arena of people where the vast majority of people have an opposing view. So people who have no respect for the Bible are generally not used to hearing direct answers from people who are confident that the answers given by scripture are pertinent; if that in turn comes across as arrogant in a world where everyone can create their own 'truth' then that's the way it is. I wish you well in all you do in life and trust that you note God's Word more carefully than you remember my own.
As far as I know I am probably the only other Christian who contributes to the CCMB. Up to now I have deliberately chosen not to respond to any of the ping-pong interactions going on in this thread (and various others of recent times), not least because I have a life outside this MB!
There are some posters who, on faith matters, I simply ignore now as it's pointless to try to engage. There are others who at least are able to put together a reasoned paragraph in response rather than “it's all bollocks” for example.
As TP says he does not anticipate much support and to win friends on the MB (same goes for me), as we are clearly in the minority, not just here but in the world in general. I suspect very few CCMB posters believe in Biblical prophecies but TP's quote from those very telling words of Jesus “If the world hates you, remember that it hated me first” - that sounds remarkably accurate to me!
I am just getting on with my life, trying my best to be a follower of Jesus, doing the things that he would expect me to do, not because I am seeking Brownie points, but out of love and respect for him. It is a relationship rather than a philosophy, a way of life not a hobby which I pursue just on a Sunday! I try to put my faith into action every day and that is my Christian witness to others i.e. judge me not by my words but by my actions - difficult on an Internet forum of course, a bit like trying to cover a snooker match on radio.
Jesus's teaching and his actions go straight to the heart of the human condition. I don't think he got too bothered about talking snakes or talking donkeys, or what age Noah lived to, in fact, he never mentions them as far as I know. (Maybe TP can confirm this as I recognise his Biblical knowledge is superior to mine). He (Jesus) is far more interested in what is in the heart of each person as that is of the utmost importance to him, anything else like status, wealth, worldly knowledge and power are irrelevant. Love God and love your neighbour is easy to say, less so to put into practice, but that's the bottom line. God came into our world in the shape of Jesus and his teaching was (and indeed still is) unpalatable to many as it requires a significant change away from our selfish human behaviour, i.e. it requires repentance. The world has largely ignored his teaching, hence we are where we are, with starvation, wars, human trafficking, and civil unrest endemic in our world.
The ruling theocracy at the time tried to exterminate him and his early followers as they were a threat to their power and authority but failed on both counts as Christianity spread throughout the Roman empire and eventually the whole world. The irony that many people seem to overlook is that Jesus was anti-authority in his day, so talk of Christianity being created to suppress the masses is nonsense; he preached freedom which was anathema to the Jewish theocracy and led to his execution.
TP and I are “on the same page” as they say, only our responsive styles are different. I agree 100% with his statement “people who have no respect for the Bible are generally not used to hearing direct answers from people who are confident that the answers given by scripture are pertinent; if that in turn comes across as arrogant in a world where everyone can create their own 'truth' then that's the way it is”.
That's the way it is people!
Thanks (Gofer) for taking the time to put this together; I agree re Noah, talking snakes etc as they only serve as convenient distractions to move the subject away from the key issue which is the status of our individual relationship with God.
As you pointed out, anyone looking at the detailed prophecies could see within ten minutes of examining them that they ultimately originate from outside our time and space.
People are very comfortable if not a little smug to point out the many faults of others including Trump; but even if they are 100% right in all they say, then does that elevate themselves 1mm in the great scheme of things? Certainly not in the sight of God!
And that's why we all need a Saviour, He who can meet our deepest need; the one individual most people will once again carefully circumnavigate this CHRISTmas
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