This flight to Rwanda

[OurManFlint II]

Re: This flight to Rwanda

Shocking as it may seem, but different people have different concerns, and are capable of thinking about more than one thing at once. I think it's reasonable to object to what's been happening tbh.

i-m not sure what you mean, sorry.

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: This flight to Rwanda

We have ridden roughshod all over the world , raping and pillaging

Look at the spread of the commonwealth and the colonies of Spain, France, Belgium etc

No wonder people from Africa and other places fleeing violence or looking for a better life are attracted to the UK and Europe

It's all very well using the cheap labour for the west indies and Asia and Eastern Europe when we need them but if they want to come when times are less prosperous we have to something better than stick em on a plane over to Rwanda

[az city]

Re: This flight to Rwanda

I'm amazed that this thread has descended into:

1 - some actual racism
2 - lots of accusations of racism
3 - zero solutions

Morning Jimbo.

I don't see anything "amazing" about 1 and 2. In fact, 2 occurring as a result of 1 is clearly logical and expected.

What I am amazed by is everyone just letting you get away with your nutty critique of the Rwanda disgrace by implicitly claiming it's acceptable because nobody has a "better" alternative. You know and I know that is BS.

Evaluate the policy at hand on its merits alone. The Rwanda disgrace is completely unacceptable on so many levels.

[Eric the Half a Bee]

Re: This flight to Rwanda

Morning Jimbo.

I don't see anything "amazing" about 1 and 2. In fact, 2 occurring as a result of 1 is clearly logical and expected.

What I am amazed by is everyone just letting you get away with your nutty critique of the Rwanda disgrace by implicitly claiming it's acceptable because nobody has a "better" alternative. You know and I know that is BS.

Evaluate the policy at hand on its merits alone. The Rwanda disgrace is completely unacceptable on so many levels.

Absolutely.

Talking about a separate issue, it is often thought that Wales gets a bad deal from the UK in terms of the Barnett formula, dished out by England. My solution is to burn and kill every Englishman. Some might be outraged, but nobody has a better alternative, this should seem perfectly acceptable.....

[JamesWales]

Re: This flight to Rwanda

Morning Jimbo.

I don't see anything "amazing" about 1 and 2. In fact, 2 occurring as a result of 1 is clearly logical and expected.

What I am amazed by is everyone just letting you get away with your nutty critique of the Rwanda disgrace by implicitly claiming it's acceptable because nobody has a "better" alternative. You know and I know that is BS.

Evaluate the policy at hand on its merits alone. The Rwanda disgrace is completely unacceptable on so many levels.

No it isn't. Calling a burglar a burglar is legitimate. Calling everyone a burglar isn't. It is perfectly legitimate to object to the current state of affairs, and think it's a policy worth trying. As usual, the language of those who oppose it is hyperbolic and defamatory to mask an absence of any viable alternative.

Why is it BS? This isn't kindergarten, or some lecture theatre where rich lecturers preach theories to rich students. This is real life. Adults should be able to discuss a policy and come up with solutions.

The current situation benefits rich migrants from safe countries over those perhaps more in need from warzones. It enriches criminal gangs who rarely use their proceeds for good causes and places a significant burden on the UK taxpayer to house, feed and process a presumably almost limitless number of people.

So yes, offer an alternative solution if you are so determined that this policy is wrong.

[JamesWales]

Re: This flight to Rwanda

Absolutely.

Talking about a separate issue, it is often thought that Wales gets a bad deal from the UK in terms of the Barnett formula, dished out by England. My solution is to burn and kill every Englishman. Some might be outraged, but nobody has a better alternative, this should seem perfectly acceptable.....

Except, many people have viable alternatives, such as renegiating the Barnett formula is probably a better deal, and is doable. Of course, Wales actually gets significantly more than it puts in from the UK central pot. Not that that makes every element of the Barnett formula ideal. Scotland gets a much better deal of course.

[Eric the Half a Bee]

Re: This flight to Rwanda

Except, many people have viable alternatives, such as renegiating the Barnett formula is probably a better deal, and is doable. Of course, Wales actually gets significantly more than it puts in from the UK central pot. Not that that makes every element of the Barnett formula ideal. Scotland gets a much better deal of course.

There we are. Kill the English. We still don't have a viable alternative.

[JamesWales]

Re: This flight to Rwanda

There we are. Kill the English. We still don't have a viable alternative.

Good one.

[Eric the Half a Bee]

Re: This flight to Rwanda

Good one.

Diolch

[JamesWales]

Re: This flight to Rwanda

Diolch

No worries. You have totally stumped us all with your fantastic analogy.

[cyril evans awaydays]

Re: This flight to Rwanda

I'm amazed that this thread has descended into:

1 - some actual racism
2 - lots of accusations of racism
3 - zero solutions

Explain what the problem you are seeking a solution for again.

[JamesWales]

Re: This flight to Rwanda

Explain what the problem you are seeking a solution for again.

Illegal immigration, exploitation of the asylum system, criminal gangs, dangerous crossings, cost of dealing with it all when the country has enormous domestic problems of its own, potential sowing of discord as a result of the above.

[Eric the Half a Bee]

Re: This flight to Rwanda

Illegal immigration, exploitation of the asylum system, criminal gangs, dangerous crossings, cost of dealing with it all when the country has enormous domestic problems of its own, potential sowing of discord as a result of the above.

Interesting that at not any point have you made any consideration for those trying to get here.

[JamesWales]

Re: This flight to Rwanda

Interesting that at not any point have you made any consideration for those trying to get here.

I perfectly well understand that many people in many parts of the world have undergone a lot of suffering and have every empathy for them. That doesn't mean that anyone who wants to come to the UK is entitled to do that, less still that they do it via payments to criminal gangs that only the wealthiest of them can afford.

Do you think everyone with cancer in the world should be treated on the NHS? I doubt you do, but that doesn't mean you don't have empathy for their situation.

[Eric Cartman]

Re: This flight to Rwanda

No it isn't. Calling a burglar a burglar is legitimate. Calling everyone a burglar isn't. It is perfectly legitimate to object to the current state of affairs, and think it's a policy worth trying. As usual, the language of those who oppose it is hyperbolic and defamatory to mask an absence of any viable alternative.

Why is it BS? This isn't kindergarten, or some lecture theatre where rich lecturers preach theories to rich students. This is real life. Adults should be able to discuss a policy and come up with solutions.

The current situation benefits rich migrants from safe countries over those perhaps more in need from warzones. It enriches criminal gangs who rarely use their proceeds for good causes and places a significant burden on the UK taxpayer to house, feed and process a presumably almost limitless number of people.

So yes, offer an alternative solution if you are so determined that this policy is wrong.

Isn't the obvious alternative just to make the legal route better? The fact that the vast majority of people entering illegally would obtain asylum status legally should tell you that the legal system is too slow or too hard to access. So speed it up or make it easier to access. Does this policy fix that? If not then all you are ensuring is to reduce the number of asylum seekers we take as a country.

The reason people use hyperbolic language to describe the policy is because unfortunately in relative terms, this is an extreme response and for a lot of people, crosses into uncomfortable territory. Which begs the question, how extreme would Patel's policy need to be for you to think it wasn't 'worth trying'? Presumably you have a line over which we shouldn't step. What if this deterrent doesn't work, how would you step it up a notch?