Coronavirus update - NO MORE RESTRICTIONS

[caerkid]

Re: Coronavirus update

I was in fact criticising Sir Keir for slagging off the UK Government when not saying anything when the Labour administration in Wales does something similar. I realise he has no actual control over the Welsh government but you would have thought they would have both sung from the same hymn sheet.

"I presume That If Keir Starmer is criticising Boris about the late Christmas change, he has also been on the phone to tell Mark Drakeford off for doing the same???

And to be fair whenever the Tories trot out their stock response to Starmer that "this isn't the time to play politics" and everyone should "get behind the government" they always caveat it with the statement "* doesn't apply in countries where we are the opposition"

[lardy]

Re: Coronavirus update

Lockdowns haven't worked. They've actually accelerated the spread - here and also in other European countries. Whilst isolated cases of bad behaviour have occurred, the pubs, bars, cafes, restaurants have helped keep people take enjoyment in a 'controlled' environment. The blanket closure/restrictions have driven them behind closed doors in houses and flats instead, in close proximity to friends and family - of all ages. Wasn't it in early March we were going to 'flatted the curve' ?

I think folk are beginning to realise that 'lockdowns' are now as much politically as medically motivated.

This is not correct. A lockdown does not increase the spread of the virus.

Logically that makes no sense, and there's no evidence for it.

And I've no idea how they are politically motivated

[the other bob wilson]

Re: Coronavirus update

There is a lot of speculation about Hancock giving contracts to his mates.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/nov/15/chumocracy-covid-revealed-shape-tory-establishment

https://www.ft.com/content/7bf2fbdc-a26b-476e-a604-fac15ecfc222

These articles are at first sight compelling and will be investigated when full details of the contracts are revealed.

What is of no doubt is the failure of the Government to deal appropriately with the Cummings debacle. He should have been sacked there and then. However, it's a big leap to suggest that those catching trains on Saturday have anything to do with the Cummings affair. It might be used as an excuse by those transgressing the rules but that doesn't wash with me.

Seeing those on London train stations probably didn't give Cummings a second thought; their driving force was to get home for Xmas and had nothing to do with Cummings. Irrespective of Cummings they would have gone anyway. Indeed the youngsters cavorting around the streets in the North of England on the weekend probably had never heard of Cummings.

While the public in general have obeyed the restrictions throughout the various lockdowns there are very many individuals that have ignored the rules and have rightfully been branded idiots as indeed was Cummings.

I took care to say some of those catching trains will have thought of Dominic Cummings, but, when you think back to the spring, high profile people such as that Professor Ferguson and the lady who is Chief Medical Officer of Scotland, to name but two, had to resign after breaking the rules. then we saw politicians like Robert Jenrick and Stephen Kinnock brazening it out before Cummings, frankly, took the piss out of us all. The spring lockdown was, generally, well observed and, for a while, an "all in it together" attitude prevailed, but Cummings especially changed all of that as people twigged that, at has always been the case, there is one rule for almost all of us and another one for the favoured few - that's what drives the sort of actions seen on Saturday night in London.

[the other bob wilson]

Re: Coronavirus update

So does the new strain knock "Herd immunity" on the head? Forget politics, (England, Wales and Scotland leaders are all different parties and none have succeeded in controlling the virus) the UK has done an awful job of dealing with this virus since day one. A pity the EU and other countries didn't lock us down in spring when this first started or in the summer when people were flying everywhere to create these new strains!!

This is a part of this whole thing which has always baffled me. A brand new lethal virus arrives on the scene at the end of 2019 and within no time we have all sorts of people stating with great certainty what will be happening in the coming months and years. Even genuine experts when it comes to the science surely could not have been totally sure what was going to happen, yet throughout 2020 we have had people on this football messageboard who have claimed they know precisely what is happening and what will happen.
I'm not an expert, but, as far as herd immunity goes, the same question has always occurred to me and I'm unaware of it ever having been answered. If we've been living through the first wave of a new virus, how can the sort of people who got to make what is now looking like a disastrous decision in Sweden have been able to say for certain that you will not get Covid once you've had it? There is evidence of people catching the virus twice, so, even if this is only happening to a small number, doesn't this knock the whole concept of herd immunity on the head?

[Allez Allez Allez]

Re: Coronavirus update

This is not correct. A lockdown does not increase the spread of the virus.

Logically that makes no sense, and there's no evidence for it.

And I've no idea how they are politically motivated

Thanks for pulling him up on his misinformation which has, most likely, come from a source that is politically motivated.

Lockdowns would be more effective if people followed the rules, of course. The reason they are put in place is to restrict those people who have a sense of moral duty to their fellow citizens. For others, they carry on as usual and moan about there being nowhere to drink and down the road there are ITUs full of dying people.

[Allez Allez Allez]

Re: Coronavirus update

This is a part of this whole thing which has always baffled me. A brand new lethal virus arrives on the scene at the end of 2019 and within no time we have all sorts of people stating with great certainty what will be happening in the coming months and years. Even genuine experts when it comes to the science surely could not have been totally sure what was going to happen, yet throughout 2020 we have had people on this football messageboard who have claimed they know precisely what is happening and what will happen.
I'm not an expert, but, as far as herd immunity goes, the same question has always occurred to me and I'm unaware of it ever having been answered. If we've been living through the first wave of a new virus, how can the sort of people who got to make what is now looking like a disastrous decision in Sweden have been able to say for certain that you will not get Covid once you've had it? There is evidence of people catching the virus twice, so, even if this is only happening to a small number, doesn't this knock the whole concept of herd immunity on the head?

Herd immunity is only ever possible, or discussed, with vaccination in mind.

The latest strain is unlikely to mean the vaccine becomes ineffective, but the virus is showing that it may be capable of vaccine escape in a few more mutations. However, the vaccines that we have are likely to be effective with tweaks thanks to the genome profiling that is taking place. The most worrying issue is, would we fall into a place where we needed 2 vaccine programs (old covid and new covid). Also antibodies of sufferers of other strains of covid seem less effective when battling the new strain.

[billy.ronson]

Re: Coronavirus update

Seeing I am only just recovering from having Covid then I guess I have to hope it was the new strain?

[Hilts]

Re: Coronavirus update

Lockdowns haven't worked. They've actually accelerated the spread - here and also in other European countries. Whilst isolated cases of bad behaviour have occurred, the pubs, bars, cafes, restaurants have helped keep people take enjoyment in a 'controlled' environment. The blanket closure/restrictions have driven them behind closed doors in houses and flats instead, in close proximity to friends and family - of all ages. Wasn't it in early March we were going to 'flatted the curve' ?

I think folk are beginning to realise that 'lockdowns' are now as much politically as medically motivated.

Youve had a mare here

[Taunton Blue Genie]

Re: Coronavirus update

One thing for everyone to bear in mind is that even if we are vaccinated against the virus and are immune to it, it will still be possible to of pass on the virus to others by transference by hand e.g. by our touching something tangible that has the virus on it and then going onto touch something else. We are well aware of this concept already, of course, but some people may forget about it in the excitement of getting a vaccination. And as for dating sites, it's best to go for much older women as they will be immunised first.....

[Allez Allez Allez]

Re: Coronavirus update

One thing for everyone to bear in mind is that even if we are vaccinated against the virus and are immune to it, it will still be possible to of pass on the virus to others by transference by hand e.g. by our touching something tangible that has the virus on it and then going onto touch something else. We are well aware of this concept already, of course, but some people may forget about it in the excitement of getting a vaccination. And as for dating sites, it's best to go for much older women as they will be immunised first.....

Yes, I think that needs to be communicated by the Government in a better way.

The Oxford vaccine has shown signs of reducing transmission, but there isn't a lot of data at the moment.

[Vindec]

Re: Coronavirus update

I took care to say some of those catching trains will have thought of Dominic Cummings, but, when you think back to the spring, high profile people such as that Professor Ferguson and the lady who is Chief Medical Officer of Scotland, to name but two, had to resign after breaking the rules. then we saw politicians like Robert Jenrick and Stephen Kinnock brazening it out before Cummings, frankly, took the piss out of us all.

Just because all of those acted stupidly doesn't mean you or I have to act inappropriately. It's a convenient excuse for some but I bet those on the station over the weekend didn't give these individuals a second thought; their motivation was to get home for Xmas. Had the episodes you quoted not have happened the probability is that these people still would have acted in the same way. They were idiots just like Cummings, Jenrick and Co.

[delmbox]

Re: Coronavirus update

Has there been any mention of a tweak to the 2m rule being that it's spread much more easily? Or is that not how it works

[Gofer Blue]

Re: Coronavirus update

I see Sainsburys have lit the blue touch paper regarding likely fresh food shortages in the supermarkets due to the French border closure. Cue a decent amount of panic buying I suspect. Thankfully I have a good stock of tinned corned beef - who needs fresh veg anyway!!

[Vindec]

Re: Coronavirus update

I see Sainsburys have lit the blue touch paper regarding likely fresh food shortages in the supermarkets due to the French border closure. Cue a decent amount of panic buying I suspect. Thankfully I have a good stock of tinned corned beef - who needs fresh veg anyway!!

There will be a shortage of toilet paper this Xmas.