The lugby…..

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: The lugby…..

I don’t understand this rugby format, probably because I pay no attention at all to it, but why do they merge teams up to make regions etc…even in recent times Wales did ok with plenty of club teams, Cardiff, Newport, ponty, pontypool, Neath, Llanelli Swansea etc….what happened to make them even consider merging? Is like if we merged with the jacks we’d have some form of super south wales region fc or both Bristol clubs united? Doesn’t really equate to success does it?

There is not enough support in finance and attendances for professional rugby which considering we are always told the country is .. RUGBY MAD ! ....sums it all up

Watching some of the games on TV there is hardly anyone there

I think a bit like football south wales people like the big events but week indeed out people just can't be arsed

[Harry Lime]

Re: The lugby…..

A late friend of mine started the Scrumbag fanzine in the late 80s. Think it had a weekly circulation of about 3-4,000 copies in it's heyday. Club rugby was still really popular. Llanelli and Swansea drew very healthy crowds, 7 - 10,000. My local side, Neath sold out most weeks with 8,000 jammed in at the Gnoll. I used to go to Aberavon in the mid to late 70s, they'd get 15,000 for games with Pontypool etc.
The 'Hairsprays' are lucky to pull in that Scrumbag circulation these days.
Club rugby is dying on its arse

[JamesWales]

Re: The lugby…..

I don’t understand this rugby format, probably because I pay no attention at all to it, but why do they merge teams up to make regions etc…even in recent times Wales did ok with plenty of club teams, Cardiff, Newport, ponty, pontypool, Neath, Llanelli Swansea etc….what happened to make them even consider merging? Is like if we merged with the jacks we’d have some form of super south wales region fc or both Bristol clubs united? Doesn’t really equate to success does it?

Yeah its shit. And it's resulted in an uncompetitive league and games that rarely matter. Rodney Parade and Cardiff Arms Park are still good days out, standing with mates with a few beers in city centre grounds etc. But the sporting spectacle is poor.

The WRU could limit the funding to top teams but there is no reason to have no means of changing those teams.

Why would anyone invest in a club like Pontypridd, Neath, Bridgend etc? These are comparable to league two football teams on paper, but can't go anywhere. It's pointless.

England never did regions and clubs like Gloucester are so much bigger than Newport now, despite being of a similar stature 15 years ago.

All that said...this all works a treat in Ireland..

[Dorcus]

Re: The lugby…..

Yeah its shit. And it's resulted in an uncompetitive league and games that rarely matter. Rodney Parade and Cardiff Arms Park are still good days out, standing with mates with a few beers in city centre grounds etc. But the sporting spectacle is poor.

The WRU could limit the funding to top teams but there is no reason to have no means of changing those teams.

Why would anyone invest in a club like Pontypridd, Neath, Bridgend etc? These are comparable to league two football teams on paper, but can't go anywhere. It's pointless.

England never did regions and clubs like Gloucester are so much bigger than Newport now, despite being of a similar stature 15 years ago.

All that said...this all works a treat in Ireland..

The worst thing that happened to Welsh rugby was the creation of "regions" which aren't "regions" they're Super Clubs and a small coterie was always going to be protected. Anyone would think Wales was as big as Brazil. What an utter pigs ear!

Welsh rugby was a product of local towns competing against each other. What a shame the structure was altered to the detriment of Welsh rugby fans

[Eric the Half a Bee]

Re: The lugby…..

A late friend of mine started the Scrumbag fanzine in the late 80s. Think it had a weekly circulation of about 3-4,000 copies in it's heyday. Club rugby was still really popular. Llanelli and Swansea drew very healthy crowds, 7 - 10,000. My local side, Neath sold out most weeks with 8,000 jammed in at the Gnoll. I used to go to Aberavon in the mid to late 70s, they'd get 15,000 for games with Pontypool etc.
The 'Hairsprays' are lucky to pull in that Scrumbag circulation these days.
Club rugby is dying on its arse

This might be of interest. https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/...-rugby-2024649

Back in 2002-03 average crowds were nowhere near those you mention and that they increased when the regions were formed.

[goats]

Re: The lugby…..

A late friend of mine started the Scrumbag fanzine in the late 80s. Think it had a weekly circulation of about 3-4,000 copies in it's heyday. Club rugby was still really popular. Llanelli and Swansea drew very healthy crowds, 7 - 10,000. My local side, Neath sold out most weeks with 8,000 jammed in at the Gnoll. I used to go to Aberavon in the mid to late 70s, they'd get 15,000 for games with Pontypool etc.
The 'Hairsprays' are lucky to pull in that Scrumbag circulation these days.
Club rugby is dying on its arse

Yes but why are attendances so bad? It’s not like the national team has been bad this last 20 years is it? I recall several grand slams etc…I’m not bothered, in fact quite delighted, as our club support has probably gone from 5000 to 20,000 in the same time frame and let’s face it the last few years haven’t been great have they? yet we can still get 28,000 for the swd. Is it something to do with the demographic of who goes to actually watch rugby? The joke that it’s mainly pissed 55 year old women that watch Wales, just to go on the lash, obviously they don’t watch any club level games so if you take those away what’s left?

[Harry Lime]

Re: The lugby…..

This might be of interest. https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/...-rugby-2024649

Back in 2002-03 average crowds were nowhere near those you mention and that they increased when the regions were formed.

I was mainly thinking about the mid 70s and 80s. Perhaps they had dropped significantly by the early 90s, or perhaps I just recall the big games and the Schweppes Cup matches.
Of course you have to remember that it was an era for declaring much lower gates than actual attendees.
Anyone going to Ninian Park during those years can testify to that

[Harry Lime]

Re: The lugby…..

Yes but why are attendances so bad? It’s not like the national team has been bad this last 20 years is it? I recall several grand slams etc…I’m not bothered, in fact quite delighted, as our club support has probably gone from 5000 to 20,000 in the same time frame and let’s face it the last few years haven’t been great have they? yet we can still get 28,000 for the swd. Is it something to do with the demographic of who goes to actually watch rugby? The joke that it’s mainly pissed 55 year old women that watch Wales, just to go on the lash, obviously they don’t watch any club level games so if you take those away what’s left?

I don't think people ever bought into the regions. Well it's pretty obvious they didn't. I can only speak for the Ospreys, but it was originally the Neath/Swansea Ospreys. Aberavon also being incorporated as a feeder club. The people I know who were Neath or Aberavon fans never embraced it. In fact I'd say most of them resented it.

[Eric the Half a Bee]

Re: The lugby…..

I was mainly thinking about the mid 70s and 80s. Perhaps they had dropped significantly by the early 90s, or perhaps I just recall the big games and the Schweppes Cup matches.
Of course you have to remember that it was an era for declaring much lower gates than actual attendees.
Anyone going to Ninian Park during those years can testify to that

During the 80s and 90s we had mainly woeful home crowds as we know. I can remember us being able to demonstrate that we were getting bigger crowds than Cardiff rugby back in the late 90s when I started going to games and, back then, most City fans had an apathy at least towards the sport, particularly where Wales or Welsh rugby was concerned.

I doubt Welsh rugby clubs or regions could claim to have the upper hand in terms of crowds from the 90s onwards. Of course, from 2000 onwards we won promotion twice and crowds built gradually. Swansea avoided going bust and even pipped us in the race to the PL. All the while club rugby crowds dwindled. I know quite a few friends who talk all things rugby online but only ever watch games on the TV.

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: The lugby…..

There is no doubt that if Cardiff and Swansea were in the Premier league and we had a capacity of 35 k and Swansea 25k there are the fans to fill it

That's not the case in Welsh club rugby

Lots of experts come international day in Wales with regards rugby but week in week out the support is all talk

No way could Cardiff Ospreys or Newport or Llanelli ever get crowds of 15000 never mind 20 plus

Leicester , Gloucester , Bath , Northampton have good support

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: The lugby…..

During the 80s and 90s we had mainly woeful home crowds as we know. I can remember us being able to demonstrate that we were getting bigger crowds than Cardiff rugby back in the late 90s when I started going to games and, back then, most City fans had an apathy at least towards the sport, particularly where Wales or Welsh rugby was concerned.

I doubt Welsh rugby clubs or regions could claim to have the upper hand in terms of crowds from the 90s onwards. Of course, from 2000 onwards we won promotion twice and crowds built gradually. Swansea avoided going bust and even pipped us in the race to the PL. All the while club rugby crowds dwindled. I know quite a few friends who talk all things rugby online but only ever watch games on the TV.

Your last line is spot on

[delmbox]

Re: The lugby…..

Your last line is spot on

Same could be true of a lot of football fans too, Cardiff City included.

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: The lugby…..

Same could be true of a lot of football fans too, Cardiff City included.

The point being that Cardiff City can and has attracted 32000 crowds for top flight league matches and if Swansea had a ground with a decent capacity the last time they were in the Premier league they would too

Even if Cardiff or Ospreys rugby were doing well the crowds wouldn't be there

[Packerman]

Re: The lugby…..

Well ospreys got 19500 Boxing Day 2023 vs scarlets. Not a fan of regional rugby but if they could attract that crowd when they haven’t been successful the years then the support may be there with a winning team. Who knows regions need scrapping imho

[Harry Lime]

Re: The lugby…..

Well ospreys got 19500 Boxing Day 2023 vs scarlets. Not a fan of regional rugby but if they could attract that crowd when they haven’t been successful the years then the support may be there with a winning team. Who knows regions need scrapping imho

Not sure which game you are on about?

The game on Boxing Day 2023 was in Llanelli and the crowd was 11,800.
They played at the Liberty a month earlier and it was the lowest crowd they'd ever had for that fixture, 8,489.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/67484019