Where do we go from here?

[City123]

Re: Where do we go from here?

I'd go even further in saying that Wintle being loaned out is a money saving option too.

It seems very odd that Wintle would be surplus to requirements, at least at the moment at his age, and Bowen would see game time.

Maybe things are a lot worse than they appear.

Or maybe they realised Wintle was maybe not good enough to force his way into the side consistently and that his development would be better served on loan at another Championship club where he'll be guaranteed games? It isn't exactly a new concept

[blue lewj]

Re: Where do we go from here?

Cost cutting IS a plan.

The main mistakes for me were the wrong signings, on inflated wages, not making time for youth to come through and relying too much on the manager.

Now we seem to be addressing some of those points - we are giving a lot more opportunities to the kids. We are getting rid of the higher wage players.
Also it's possible that the manager has less sway than before, as it felt like he wanted Marley Watkins here, but we ultimately didn't sign him - would be interesting to know who were the voices pro ad against that signing. Have the board gained enough experience to make that call themselves? or are there other voices in the club they trust now.

It is a plan in footballing terms if we know what we need to do once we are down to a complete skeleton of a squad.

It is a scary prospect that the people in charge at the moment be in charge of rebuilding a squad from little above scratch.

[blue lewj]

Re: Where do we go from here?

Or maybe they realised Wintle was maybe not good enough to force his way into the side consistently and that his development would be better served on loan at another Championship club where he'll be guaranteed games? It isn't exactly a new concept

But Bowen is?

[Llandaff Blue]

Re: Where do we go from here?

Or maybe they realised Wintle was maybe not good enough to force his way into the side consistently and that his development would be better served on loan at another Championship club where he'll be guaranteed games? It isn't exactly a new concept

Wintle is 24, hardly a development talent. No-one can tell me with a straight face Bowen is a better option, or that the midfielders he should be replacing are so much better than him that he has to go out on loan for a year.

[Rjk]

Re: Where do we go from here?

Wintle is 24, hardly a development talent. No-one can tell me with a straight face Bowen is a better option, or that the midfielders he should be replacing are so much better than him that he has to go out on loan for a year.

Wintle needs a lot of games, if he can get them at Blackpool with them paying their wages then that's still ok.
Bowen will be getting a few minutes here and there, so far easier to accommodate even with the other CM s we have

[City123]

Re: Where do we go from here?

Wintle is 24, hardly a development talent. No-one can tell me with a straight face Bowen is a better option, or that the midfielders he should be replacing are so much better than him that he has to go out on loan for a year.

Precisely why he needs games now. Bowen is younger and the experience of a few games/minutes and being in the first team squad will be more beneficial for him than it would have been for Wintle, who needs to play at that age.

[City123]

Re: Where do we go from here?

Wintle needs a lot of games, if he can get them at Blackpool with them paying their wages then that's still ok.
Bowen will be getting a few minutes here and there, so far easier to accommodate even with the other CM s we have

Precisely.

[surge]

Re: Where do we go from here?

One man's rebuild process is another man's using kids because we have allowed our squad to become paper thin.

What parts of the rebuild process are going well for you?

Playing squad:

- Becoming younger and more skillful - not being shown at this moment in time because defenders and CM hasn't really been looked at yet but type of player being brought in shows understanding of need to develop while cutting wage bill.

- Players we've signed have been spoken about positively by those I judge to have a good grasp on things (various acquisitions appearing on Notthe20's one's to watch) which suggests some good thinking going on even if not always successful.

Youth development:

- Real interest now in bringing through youth from within and being able to attract players let go from likes of Leeds and Man United as Brentford did with London clubs

- Some hints of looking at paying for Category 1/Tier 1 Academy - though it shouldn't stop at hints

- Keeping Steve Morrison seems like a positive move

Infrastructure:

- House of sport 1-3(?) plus now firm intentions to link up with local Universities to further improve facilities
- Previous stadium expansion isn't recent thing but was a good bit of longer term thinking

Clearly there are things less than ideal and this summer is a big moment to either commitment to improvements or go in the wrong direction (if things do go in wrong direction there's a good chance it's because Mick's contract is a year too long) but there are things which are going right

[Llandaff Blue]

Re: Where do we go from here?

Precisely why he needs games now. Bowen is younger and the experience of a few games/minutes and being in the first team squad will be more beneficial for him than it would have been for Wintle, who needs to play at that age.

The point I'm making is if he's not good enough to get a look in now he's never going to be good enough. 24 years old with nearly 200 professional appearances and he needs more games to develop? I don't agree. He hardly has the best competition in the middle, surely he's better than Vaulks

[Eric the Half a Bee]

Re: Where do we go from here?

Playing squad:

- Becoming younger and more skillful - not being shown at this moment in time because defenders and CM hasn't really been looked at yet but type of player being brought in shows understanding of need to develop while cutting wage bill.

- Players we've signed have been spoken about positively by those I judge to have a good grasp on things (various acquisitions appearing on Notthe20's one's to watch) which suggests some good thinking going on even if not always successful.

So we bring them into an alien footballing environment where, instead of playing a decent passing game they enjoy at all levels below the first team, they now have to run around like headless chickens and watch the ball being whacked aimlessly from back to front. We then judge their ability and potential in tactics that they've never experienced, rather than trying to accommodate the type of game they are used to at under 23 level etc.

[Rjk]

Re: Where do we go from here?

The point I'm making is if he's not good enough to get a look in now he's never going to be good enough. 24 years old with nearly 200 professional appearances and he needs more games to develop? I don't agree. He hardly has the best competition in the middle, surely he's better than Vaulks

He's getting a look in at Blackpool, he's getting games under his belt at this level. Next season we will likely be wthout ralls, pack and vaulks, so if he's shown he's capable at this level he can some straight in.
With so many other new faces being bedded in I expect MM wanted to predominantly use his experienced midfielders this season. I certainly don't think it is because Wintle isn't good enough

[blue lewj]

Re: Where do we go from here?

The point I'm making is if he's not good enough to get a look in now he's never going to be good enough. 24 years old with nearly 200 professional appearances and he needs more games to develop? I don't agree. He hardly has the best competition in the middle, surely he's better than Vaulks

I'm with you on this totally. There is more to this than meets the eye.

Did McCarthy want him? Was it Wintle or another?

I welcome the change in thought on potentially bringing through youth but it is difficult. If it was that easy everybody would be doing it. Just throwing them in and hoping for the best will have its downside.

[Rjk]

Re: Where do we go from here?

I'm with you on this totally. There is more to this than meets the eye.

Did McCarthy want him? Was it Wintle or another?

I welcome the change in thought on potentially bringing through youth but it is difficult. If it was that easy everybody would be doing it. Just throwing them in and hoping for the best will have its downside.

most other people have been doing it. We've been at the extreme end of ignoring youth for years, now we are just at the upper end of including them. Yes they won't all make it but if a few of them do then it'll make rebuilding massively easier.

[surge]

Re: Where do we go from here?

So we bring them into an alien footballing environment where, instead of playing a decent passing game they enjoy at all levels below the first team, they now have to run around like headless chickens and watch the ball being whacked aimlessly from back to front. We then judge their ability and potential in tactics that they've never experienced, rather than trying to accommodate the type of game they are used to at under 23 level etc.

But at the moment the bulk of our team is still old-school Cardiff. We can only hope the youngsters are getting street-wise this year and ready to play in a more skillful way next year.

I'm not saying everything is going right, and recognise Mick's contract might be a year too long for reasons you've alluded to in your post, but the idea that nothing is going right is not one I can agree with and think we need to be a bit more patient.

Basically, there could be plenty of opportunity to moan this summer onwards (have the board been guessing and really all these good moves are based on nothing?) but right now it appears there's more good than bad and often the last piece of the puzzle is improved performances on the pitch.