Immigration and The NHS

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Excellent documentary on BBC one now

Without immigration it would be completely fecked

And in the south wales valleys whole communities would be without health services full stop

Given the racism so many of the people received its amazing so many stayed

Doctors , nurses , porters , cooks , cleaners

13 percent of NHS were born overseas

40 percent of those working in the NHS are from ethnic minority heritage

[Taunton Blue Genie]

Re: Immigration and The NHS

No-one in their right mind can deny the incredible contribution that immigrants have played in the NHS but it does beg the question as to why a rich country like the UK is dependent on people coming from poorer areas of the world to do such highly skilled jobs and leaving their own communities all the poorer for their absence. Just a thought...

[Vindec]

Re: Immigration and The NHS

No-one in their right mind can deny the incredible contribution that immigrants have played in the NHS but it does beg the question as to why a rich country like the UK is dependent on people coming from poorer areas of the world to do such highly skilled jobs and leaving their own communities all the poorer for their absence. Just a thought...

It's more than a thought - it's immoral. A poor country training doctors and nurses only be poached by the NHS is wrong. It shouldn't happen and is a failure of successive governments in training UK staff.

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: Immigration and The NHS

In the early fifties we had that post war baby boom , rapid population increase etc

Doctors were needed , many doctors came from India and Pakistan where schools set up during colonial days taught English, many nurses came from west indies , again where language was not an issue

[Wash DC Blue]

Re: Immigration and The NHS

It’s a double edged sword I think.
Medical professionals from all over the world have landed in the UK and helped the NHS...and indeed saved it.

The burden of Immigration on the NHS takes its toll as well, with things like translation costs (genuine or fraudulent).

It’s flawed, abused and certainly mismanaged.
To me though, the NHS is the pinnacle of humanity.

Health Insurance, Pharma, and Health Care Providers here are a nothing short of a disgrace.

[life on mars]

Re: Immigration and The NHS

Very revealing , shows the contribution immigration has made to the NHS .

[az city]

Re: Immigration and The NHS

I don't think it's as simple as the NHS "poaching" medical staff from poorer countries, leaving those countries with denuded health systems. Many medically-trained professionals from developing countries can't wait to move to a system where the pay and conditions are far superior.

This phenomenon is also true for UK-trained medical professionals who move to the US because the pay is way better here. So the UK loses a lot of staff because of the same revolving door.

[Taunton Blue Genie]

Re: Immigration and The NHS

I don't think it's as simple as the NHS "poaching" medical staff from poorer countries, leaving those countries with denuded health systems. Many medically-trained professionals from developing countries can't wait to move to a system where the pay and conditions are far superior.

This phenomenon is also true for UK-trained medical professionals who move to the US because the pay is way better here. So the UK loses a lot of staff because of the same revolving door.

I fully understand all that but there was supposedly a 50,000 shortfall in nursing staff before Corona Virus hit - and that figure would obviously be higher if it weren't for immigrant nurses, if we can use that term. My last long-term partner was (and still is) a qualified nurse with a particular specialism and whose salary was far lower than I considered a fair reward for her considerable skills.

[Seabird]

Re: Immigration and The NHS

Excellent programme, I thought.

I can't say I've been enamoured by some of the Asian GPs I've encountered but the NHS was/is heavily reliant on them.

[Feedback]

Re: Immigration and The NHS

It’s a double edged sword I think.
Medical professionals from all over the world have landed in the UK and helped the NHS...and indeed saved it.

The burden of Immigration on the NHS takes its toll as well, with things like translation costs (genuine or fraudulent).

It’s flawed, abused and certainly mismanaged.
To me though, the NHS is the pinnacle of humanity.

Health Insurance, Pharma, and Health Care Providers here are a nothing short of a disgrace.

I was going to say "if you thinknits bad here you should see what it's like in the US" but then I saw who posted.

Only 37 of the 38 highest earning nations have managed to put in place socialised healthcare, so you can see why the US struggles with implementing it.

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: Immigration and The NHS

Excellent programme, I thought.

I can't say I've been enamoured by some of the Asian GPs I've encountered but the NHS was/is heavily reliant on them.

The valleys wouldn't have doctors in many towns if it wasn't for immigration from the Indian sub continent

Huge influx of philipino nurses to the main hospitals in South Wales too

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: Immigration and The NHS

I fully understand all that but there was supposedly a 50,000 shortfall in nursing staff before Corona Virus hit - and that figure would obviously be higher if it weren't for immigrant nurses, if we can use that term. My last long-term partner was (and still is) a qualified nurse with a particular specialism and whose salary was far lower than I considered a fair reward for her considerable skills.

following the pandemic , after Boris came out clapping like a seal, he rewarded the nurses with a 1 percent pay rise

No wonder there is a shortfall of nurses in the UK

[Feedback]

Re: Immigration and The NHS

following the pandemic , after Boris came out clapping like a seal, he rewarded the nurses with a 1 percent pay rise

No wonder there is a shortfall of nurses in the UK

its a bit hard to give pay rises beyond that when many workers lost their jobs during this time. Most medical professionals I know were worked to exhaustion, but appreciated they were still being paid.

the proof of what this government believes their worth to be comes after the pandemic, when things settle down and we return to some normality regarding tax and spending.

[LeningradCowboy]

Re: Immigration and The NHS

https://publishing.rcseng.ac.uk/doi/full/10.1308/rcsbull.2020.78

Why is there a shortage of doctors in the UK?

[Nobody's Rep]

Re: Immigration and The NHS

I fully understand all that but there was supposedly a 50,000 shortfall in nursing staff before Corona Virus hit - and that figure would obviously be higher if it weren't for immigrant nurses, if we can use that term. My last long-term partner was (and still is) a qualified nurse with a particular specialism and whose salary was far lower than I considered a fair reward for her considerable skills.

Surely any conversation about shortfalls in health staff whether primary or secondary needs to be had in the same breath as a similar conversation around socika care - I would have thought the pandemic would have ensured that now.

As for skills versus pay absolutely right - my daughter and wife work in front line NHS and they and thousands of others have gone beyond their grade and normal expectations in the last 18 months but as long as we try to keep people in their homes longer and maintain their independence the greater the skill needs required for home care staff and by consequence care home staff - both groups recognised as being underpaid and suffer huge recruitment issues - thinking in Wales is ahead of England on both systems but still needs huge investment