Palestine Action

[JamesWales]

Re: Palestine Action

Reading that, you can only be grateful that those who got stupid and unfair laws changed down the centuries, sometimes paying with their lives for their beliefs, defied the powers that be of their day, rather than adapt your rather moveable acceptance of obeying the law of the land, All you've done for nearly a day now is talk to us as if we're too dense to understand the only point you keep on making to justify your opinion - everyone understands what you're saying, it's not as if it will all suddenly click into place and we'll say "James Wales was right you know".

Also, what was this "targetting" of UK Military equipment you talk about? They spray painted it, does spray painting stop modern and sophisticated weaponry working? Does it destroy it? How does spray painting anything warrant an accusation of terrorism and proscribing of the organisation responsible?

You say it's a stupid and unfair law, but thats cos you believe in it. And as I said, I do sense you wouldn't care less from a moral position if you didn't personally believe it. Groups aren't proscribed for nothing.

Essentially unless someone entirely agrees with you on this then you aren't interested in heating their position. And you posted something very condescending to me so don't be surprised if I respond in detail.

You keep characterising the most recent incident as graffiti. It wasn't. The engines were put out of use and replaced as the substance was sprayed into them to disable them. That's the point. Their policy is to target UK military equipment to force policy change. It's not hard to see how that crosses a threshold.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cpv048p8g9lo

[az city]

Re: Palestine Action

You say it's a stupid and unfair law, but thats cos you believe in it. And as I said, I do sense you wouldn't care less from a moral position if you didn't personally believe it. Groups aren't proscribed for nothing.

Essentially unless someone entirely agrees with you on this then you aren't interested in heating their position. And you posted something very condescending to me so don't be surprised if I respond in detail.

You keep characterising the most recent incident as graffiti. It wasn't. The engines were put out of use and replaced as the substance was sprayed into them to disable them. That's the point. Their policy is to target UK military equipment to force policy change. It's not hard to see how that crosses a threshold.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cpv048p8g9lo

You have a slavish devotion to a pedantic and idiotic position. Sometimes the law is an ass.

[JamesWales]

Re: Palestine Action

You have a slavish devotion to a pedantic and idiotic position. Sometimes the law is an ass.

Sometimes it is. But the definition of whether it is or isn't is not based upon what your personal beliefs are.

As stated, if a group has a policy or specifically targeting UK military equipment to make their political point then it's not hard to see why it would be proscribed. And once done it's not hard to see why people showing support for it would be arrested.

[az city]

Re: Palestine Action

Sometimes it is. But the definition of whether it is or isn't is not based upon what your personal beliefs are.

As stated, if a group has a policy or specifically targeting UK military equipment to make their political point then it's not hard to see why it would be proscribed. And once done it's not hard to see why people showing support for it would be arrested.

That is your "personal belief".

[JamesWales]

Re: Palestine Action

That is your "personal belief".

Is it? I'm pretty sure it's a result of the government process. You can personally think it's wrong. You can also personally think that any number of criminal trials or convictions were or weren't wrong if you like. But don't be surprised if targeting UK military sites gets you proscribed and don't be surprised when supporting the said group gets you arrested, irrespective of whether you think you are above the law or consider it an ass or not. I'm sure the proscription took in far more evidence than what has been offered on here.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/three-groups-to-be-proscribed

[the other bob wilson]

Re: Palestine Action

You say it's a stupid and unfair law, but thats cos you believe in it. And as I said, I do sense you wouldn't care less from a moral position if you didn't personally believe it. Groups aren't proscribed for nothing.

Essentially unless someone entirely agrees with you on this then you aren't interested in heating their position. And you posted something very condescending to me so don't be surprised if I respond in detail.

You keep characterising the most recent incident as graffiti. It wasn't. The engines were put out of use and replaced as the substance was sprayed into them to disable them. That's the point. Their policy is to target UK military equipment to force policy change. It's not hard to see how that crosses a threshold.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cpv048p8g9lo

£2 million? Easy to pluck figures that can’t be disproved out of the air and the Government have to say things like that to try to not look as bad as various “banana republics” with very dubious human rights records.

I see Andrew Neil, whose politics I disagree with profoundly does not agree with you.

[JamesWales]

Re: Palestine Action

£2 million? Easy to pluck figures that can’t be disproved out of the air and the Government have to say things like that to try to not look as bad as various “banana republics” with very dubious human rights records.

I see Andrew Neil, whose politics I disagree with profoundly does not agree with you.

It doesn't say £2m it says £7m and you are drifting into conspiracy territory now claiming the govt and police are making things up. Needless to say the cost to the public purse continues to go up too.

Good for Andrew Neil. Proof free speech does exist eh! I don't think he's as supportive as you make out btw, if you listen to it all.

We are going around in circles now anyway. I'm really sorry I don't agree with you on this. I know it upsets you.

[cyril evans awaydays]

Re: Palestine Action

Sometimes it is. But the definition of whether it is or isn't is not based upon what your personal beliefs are.

As stated, if a group has a policy or specifically targeting UK military equipment to make their political point then it's not hard to see why it would be proscribed. And once done it's not hard to see why people showing support for it would be arrested.

Your thoughts on people punished for breaking the speed limit.

We live in a democracy, we are allowed to disagree with laws and debate their usefulness. In this case I think it's stupid and if I think a law is stupid then I don't think breaking it should be punishable.

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: Palestine Action

Your thoughts on people punished for breaking the speed limit.

We live in a democracy, we are allowed to disagree with laws and debate their usefulness. In this case I think it's stupid and if I think a law is stupid then I don't think breaking it should be punishable.

Oops 😬

[az city]

Re: Palestine Action

As Jimbo's likely favorite TV celeb would say, "gotcha".

[JamesWales]

Re: Palestine Action

Driving 24 mph is hardly the same as supporting a proscribed terrorist group is it? Or being flabbergasted when if someone got a fine for it!
🤣

That's like me finding any example of you believing in the rule of law and claiming thats a gotcha too!

[the other bob wilson]

Re: Palestine Action

It doesn't say £2m it says £7m and you are drifting into conspiracy territory now claiming the govt and police are making things up. Needless to say the cost to the public purse continues to go up too.

Good for Andrew Neil. Proof free speech does exist eh! I don't think he's as supportive as you make out btw, if you listen to it all.

We are going around in circles now anyway. I'm really sorry I don't agree with you on this. I know it upsets you.

7 million’s even more ridiculous. Ah, the very selective free speech argument makes an appearance.

I listened to it all and, as I would expect, i don’t agree with Andrew Neil on all he says, but “uneasy” is a good word to use to describe a decision that should have been fully though through before going ahead with it.

Not upset in the slightest about my opinion being different from yours - the word I’d use in light of some of the things you’ve said on here recently is reassured.

[the other bob wilson]

Re: Palestine Action

Your thoughts on people punished for breaking the speed limit.

We live in a democracy, we are allowed to disagree with laws and debate their usefulness. In this case I think it's stupid and if I think a law is stupid then I don't think breaking it should be punishable.

Well, well, well - who’d have thought it? As I mentioned “a very moveable opinion on accepting the law of the land”.

[JamesWales]

Re: Palestine Action

7 million’s even more ridiculous. Ah, the very selective free speech argument makes an appearance.

I listened to it all and, as I would expect, i don’t agree with Andrew Neil on all he says, but “uneasy” is a good word to use to describe a decision that should have been fully though through before going ahead with it.

Not upset in the slightest about my opinion being different from yours - the word I’d use in light of some of the things you’ve said on here recently is reassured.

Why is it ridiculous? Are you a military equipment expert now too? The police, government are all lying and you are right?

[JamesWales]

Re: Palestine Action

Well, well, well - who’d have thought it? As I mentioned “a very moveable opinion on accepting the law of the land”.

Not really. As I've consistently said. I understand why the group was proscribed. If you support proscribed groups then you can expect to get arrested. People test the law all the time but they should expect what they get