Another Brexit Bonus

[Swiss Peter]

Re: Another Brexit Bonus

With new levels of instability in NI, the standing and reputation of this country amongst our immediate neighbours and allies (and, it seems, many in positions of influence in the States) at a low point, and now our world-leading thinkers not being able to access world-leading research programmes, can any of the Brexit fan club please start pointing to the counter-balancing benefits yet?. Still too early?

This article is hilarious. Daily Express journalists trying to put a positive spin on bad news.

https://www.express.co.uk/news/scien...pe-alternative

[Swiss Peter]

Re: Another Brexit Bonus

Record oil and gas exports to the EU.

I swear, the guardian staff must have keyboards with a specific 'despite brexit' key to save time.
https://www.theguardian.com/business...ukraine-brexit

....and, of course, without Brexit none of this would have been possible.

[Pilkers]

Re: Another Brexit Bonus

Record oil and gas exports to the EU.

I swear, the guardian staff must have keyboards with a specific 'despite brexit' key to save time.
https://www.theguardian.com/business...ukraine-brexit

Which begs the question, why should fuel be so expensive in the UK? A commodity we are obviously still flush with. The government taking a bigger slice in taxation than anyone else I suspect. I filled up with diesel at Rosslare europort at 30p a litre cheaper than it is here last week, we export it to them yet they can still mark it up and retail cheaper than us!

No wonder the cost of living crisis is so much worse here, Brexit and being taxed to fug is killing us.

[JamesWales]

Re: Another Brexit Bonus

....and, of course, without Brexit none of this would have been possible.

I'm not saying that. I've always been of the belief that leaving or remaining in the EU would have far less of an impact than many on either side suggested.

FYI - Exports to the EU are the highest since records began. Why isn't that reported?

https://www.ons.gov.uk/economy/nationalaccounts/balanceofpayments/bulletins/uktrade/april2022#main-points

[JamesWales]

Re: Another Brexit Bonus

Which begs the question, why should fuel be so expensive in the UK? A commodity we are obviously still flush with. The government taking a bigger slice in taxation than anyone else I suspect. I filled up with diesel at Rosslare europort at 30p a litre cheaper than it is here last week, we export it to them yet they can still mark it up and retail cheaper than us!

No wonder the cost of living crisis is so much worse here, Brexit and being taxed to fug is killing us.

Fuel isn't particularly more expensive in the UK than elsewhere though and neither is the cost of living. In fact, the disparity between wage rises and inflation is lower here than elsewhere.

https://autotraveler.ru/en/spravka/fuel-price-in-europe.html

[Swiss Peter]

Re: Another Brexit Bonus

I'm not saying that. I've always been of the belief that leaving or remaining in the EU would have far less of an impact than many on either side suggested.

FYI - Exports to the EU are the highest since records began. Why isn't that reported?
https://www.ons.gov.uk/economy/natio...22#main-points

Maybe because it is all a bit inconclusive. Does the growth in UK's trade with EU outstrip that of other similar economies? Is the growth higher than would have been the case if UK had remained in the EU?

I certainly don't know, but some people (no doubt with their own agendas) think the answer to both questions over the longer term is 'no'.

https://www.ft.com/content/2f63ef97-...d-4fb2e7ee9a5a

(Behind a firewall for me now, so may also be for others)

Anyway, trade impacts are only one aspect, which it seems can be argued either way depending on which data and timescales you look at. In a sense maybe I'm partly agreeing with with your second sentence. I think our international standing and reputation, the delicate political situation in NI, and our access to world leading research are also critical issues. Do you think we are in a better place now than without Brexit when you look at this bigger picture?

[JamesWales]

Re: Another Brexit Bonus

Maybe because it is all a bit inconclusive. Does the growth in UK's trade with EU outstrip that of other similar economies? Is the growth higher than would have been the case if UK had remained in the EU?

I certainly don't know, but some people (no doubt with their own agendas) think the answer to both questions over the longer term is 'no'.

https://www.ft.com/content/2f63ef97-...d-4fb2e7ee9a5a

(Behind a firewall for me now, so may also be for others)

Anyway, trade impacts are only one aspect, which it seems can be argued either way depending on which data and timescales you look at. In a sense maybe I'm partly agreeing with with your second sentence. I think our international standing and reputation, the delicate political situation in NI, and our access to world leading research are also critical issues. Do you think we are in a better place now than without Brexit when you look at this bigger picture?

We don't know the answer to your questions. What we do know is that exports are at a record high (would be nice if the BBC reported it) and our unemployment is lower and our wages-inflation rate, whilst poor is vastly better than the EU's at the moment - all of it points to our problems not being caused by the big B and perhaps even being aided by it.

We would all agree that the pandemic has absolutely shattered any ability to properly analyse things. I think the country is more divided than it should be, though I do largely pin that on those that didn't accept the result and fought against it. In other terms, I think it's neutral, perhaps better as the vaccine rollout and wage growth is perhaps aided by it.

[Swiss Peter]

Re: Another Brexit Bonus

We don't know the answer to your questions. What we do know is that exports are at a record high (would be nice if the BBC reported it) and our unemployment is lower and our wages-inflation rate, whilst poor is vastly better than the EU's at the moment - all of it points to our problems not being caused by the big B and perhaps even being aided by it.

We would all agree that the pandemic has absolutely shattered any ability to properly analyse things. I think the country is more divided than it should be, though I do largely pin that on those that didn't accept the result and fought against it. In other terms, I think it's neutral, perhaps better as the vaccine rollout and wage growth is perhaps aided by it.

Thanks for the genuine answer to a genuine question.

Of course, the more we consider unquantifiable things like international standing/reputation, the more we have to rely on our own perceptions. You regard the wider picture as 'neutral', I think the wider picture is an embarrassing utterly avoidable mess.

By the way, you slipped in 'vaccination rollout' as a Brexit benefit. It's old ground, but people forget stuff, so just as a quick reminder, the facts are actually:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/55163730

https://www.channel4.com/news/factch...-authorisation

[Doucas]

Re: Another Brexit Bonus

More brexit bonuses https://news.sky.com/story/brexit-wi...-says-12638190

[life on mars]

Re: Another Brexit Bonus

If Brexit was / is so bad why has exports performed well .

I do know a few lads who have now picked up work due to the less reliance on Eastern Europeans in the jobs market , in some cases wages have risen as a result of cheap labour no longer keeping wages down ie HGV drivers which is a favourite job the Eastern Europeans were keen on .

Our employment figures are very impressive , considering we have been through a pandemic ,Furlough was a brilliant move that needed applauding ..

I don't think leaving has been the disaster that many predicted ,most of our current woes are due to Pandemic ,World Supply Supply Breakdown , global inflation , Ukraine , Fuel , Wheat crisis ...

I have been impressed how quickly we have reacted to supporting Ukraine so much quicker and better than the EU along with the funding , rollout of the Vaccine which was first class .

I do think it shows we can do things on our own , albeit we still need to be a partner and a close ally of the EU ..


You'd think if Brexit was going to hurt us , our inflation woes would be so much worse than they are now , the pound would be weaker against the Euro , in fact its been very steady at 115 / 117 , as it has against other currencies and the stock markets is still delivering surely folk can see now its not all been that forecasted project doom ??

[life on mars]

Re: Another Brexit Bonus

We could follow Germanys recent decision to fire up 150 coal plants and increase its exports and jobs , however the Germans Greens are kicking off , suppose they rather see folk freeze with less Russian Oil ?????

Germany already uses coal for power 27 times higher than UK because of the depth of their manufacturing base which drives the need for much more fuel than us , we moved away form heavy industry into service and tech , finance and sciences industries , who is the doing the right thing for the future , where will we be in 10 years time ????

[Tito Fuente]

Re: Another Brexit Bonus

suppose they rather see folk freeze with less Russian Oil ?????

That's literally what you've been advocating for

[JamesWales]

Re: Another Brexit Bonus

More brexit bonuses https://news.sky.com/story/brexit-wi...-says-12638190

I respect the Resolution Foundation, they aren't some batty politically biased thinktank like many are, who just churn out what their funders pay for.

That said, I think the headlines are a bit questionable. It is near impossible to untangle the pandemic and then Ukraine from anything. It is also still relatively new territory and even Brexits biggest backers would recognise gains would be long term. It's also another example of a prediction that is somewhat undermined by fact.

Unemployment IS lower in the UK than the EU
Wages are rising faster in the UK than the EU (and far faster than before we left) - alas, inflation more than wipes it out, but as discussed elsewhere this is a problem inside and out of the EU
Exports to the EU are at a record high

Now of course, we don't know what would have happened had we stayed, and it's a valid point on the depreciation of the pound (but note also that the euro is at a 20 year low against the dollar at the moment) but it's highly unlikely we would be vastly outperforming other EU nation - more reasonable to assume we would be doing as they currently are, which as stated is in many respects worse than us.

[jon1959]

Re: Another Brexit Bonus

That's literally what you've been advocating for

Unreal!

[life on mars]

Re: Another Brexit Bonus

Unreal!

Of course over populated region anyways , I'm just in alignment with the Greens and Greta ...........