Attendances holding up well

[William Treseder]

Re: Attendances holding up well

As I said, in my opinion, Premier League football is the biggest watched (on telly obviously),and talked about sport in Wales.

I’m sure plenty of Derby, Stoke, Norwich and Ipswich fans watch plenty of premier league games on TV, but only when their own teams aren’t playing. There’s no 2 ways about it, football fans in Cardiff and the surrounding areas are as fickle as they come.

[splott parker]

Re: Attendances holding up well

I’m sure plenty of Derby, Stoke, Norwich and Ipswich fans watch plenty of premier league games on TV, but only when their own teams aren’t playing. There’s no 2 ways about it, football fans in Cardiff and the surrounding areas are as fickle as they come.

The point I’m making is that the City missed the boat at crucial times, we didn’t go up when our local support was buoyant, late 60s/early 70s. That would have been the crucial time, large crowds, football not widespread on tv, for a few seasons knocking on the door. Many say it was the board’s (Fred Dewey) reluctance to go the extra mile in the transfer market that did for us. Our fall from grace for over twenty years when football crowds were generally shite anyway. Italian ‘90 sparked a resurgence, 2 years later the Premier League began, the clubs we’ve named were knocking around the top two divisions, where were we? Our local potential fans were enticed by the ‘Big Time’, fans of other similar sized clubs were part of this ‘Big Time’, their fans were part of it with their local teams……we were home to Rochdale, away to Hartlepool etc, we didn’t have a prayer.

[Rock_Flock_of_Five]

Re: Attendances holding up well

Leicester City have huge competition with the Leicester Tigers.
Leicester rugby club often average over 20,000 per season.

Also, take a look at Bristol. Three teams all trying to take a slice of the pie... Bristol City, Rovers, and the Bristol Bears rugby.

[Mr Ducie]

Re: Attendances holding up well

Leicester City have huge competition with the Leicester Tigers.
Leicester rugby club often average over 20,000 per season.

Also, take a look at Bristol. Three teams all trying to take a slice of the pie... Bristol City, Rovers, and the Bristol Bears rugby.

Leicester were Premier League champions not that long ago and have been in the top division significantly longer than our two seasons in the last 70 years.

Bristol City’s attendance figures are very similar to ours and if your a Bristol Bears supporter who purchases hospitality packages for the Bears you are also entitled to watch Bristol City, whether you attend or not.

[A Quiet Monkfish]

Re: Attendances holding up well

If I track our club's fortunes since I first watching them 62 seasons ago [!], we have been in the top flight just 2 of those seasons. Essentially, if you were to describe us, we're a Championship club who averages a mid table finish, with occasional spells in the lower leagues and two 'one-offs' in the top flight. I'd say we're on a par with Hull. Even Bolton have had 22 top flight seasons since 1963. I reckon we could add 3 or 4000 to our current crowds if our fan base had been secured with some decent top flight runs.

[Feedback]

Re: Attendances holding up well

I don’t believe that’s the reason for Norwich’s attendances being consistently higher (and steadier) than Cardiff’s.

We can get significantly bigger crowds than them if things are going well, but our fans drift away when things aren’t so good. Historically, that’s always been the case.

Some areas, cities and towns are more committed to their football teams than others. Why that’s so is unclear, but I think it’s a bit of a cop out to suggest it’s because more goes on here than there.

If we’re doing well, people readily find the money to buy tickets. If we’re not, plenty won’t bother.

I'd hazard a guess some of these places are more affluent. The richest part of the UK, apart from London, is East Anglia (or perhaps the south east). Cardiff's catchment area includes some of the most deprived areas of the UK. That has to be a factor.

[TheBirchgrovePub]

Re: Attendances holding up well

I do think our years in the doldrums over 20 odd years ago contribute to our fickle crowds. The birth of the Premier League which while we were still kicking about in the basement may be a factor also. Clubs like Norwich, Ipswich, Derby, the Sheffields etc etc all had a few goes in the sunshine. Also when we were attracting 3 & 4 thousand crowds, wall to wall tv coverage of the likes of Man U, Liverpool etc attracted the armchair South Walian, more attractive to the floating fan than Darlington home.

Football is the most popular game in Wales but, unfortunately, its Premier League football. We missed the boat big time, just like we did 20 odd years earlier, late 60s, pushing for Division One, gates of 20,000 + were common down the City, when attendances generally were falling. Everyone in my school was a City fan. We failed to make the final step, when it was within touch, and fell away badly.

Again , the Norwichs, Ipswichs, Derbys, Stokes etc all reached and did well in the top flight while we, sadly, petered away. Their fans stuck because of this, quite understandably.

Nail on the head this. Add in the fans we lost or fell out of love a bit with the rebrand and we're up against it.

Not one for the sleeping giant rubbish but I do think a period of 6-7 years in the Prem and we'd be 30k regularly and most likely keep 80% of that if we went down. We're just lacking any sort of top flight success that has brought new fans in.

[Feedback]

Re: Attendances holding up well

I think people are in danger of making this more complicated than it needs to be. South Wales isn't flush with disposable cash, and people pick and choose what they spend their money on.

We've also had the past 40 or so years where city have been unfashionable, and young kids picked up on Liverpool, Man united, Forest, Derby, Villa, Arsenal, Everton, Spurs, and now Man City and Chelsea. Some grow out of it and start going to football with their mates, others stick with "their" teams. South Wales has a lot of fans who support their teams like their wives watch Eastenders...from the comfort of their armchair.

its not unique to Cardiff but its more prevalent.

[The Lone Gunman]

Re: Attendances holding up well

I think people are in danger of making this more complicated than it needs to be.

Indeed. A wide variety of factors mean that Cardiff City simply isn’t as big a football club as some seem to believe it is.

We’ve recently had people on this board claiming that playing against Cardiff is the biggest game most League One clubs will have had for many years. This in a division that has recently included the likes of Birmingham, Derby, Ipswich, Sheffield Wednesday and Sunderland.

[City123]

Re: Attendances holding up well

We've never had a great deal of success, especially compared to some of the other clubs listed here and spent a long time in the bottom 2 divisions just when football was experiencing a boom with the advent of the Premier League. We just about scrape into the top 40 for seasons spent in the top flight and spent more time in the 3rd tier than the first

Add in the rugby factor and economy of south Wales and its not exactly a surprise that we don't get 40,000 crowds

[Feedback]

Re: Attendances holding up well

Indeed. A wide variety of factors mean that Cardiff City simply isn’t as big a football club as some seem to believe it is.

We’ve recently had people on this board claiming that playing against Cardiff is the biggest game most League One clubs will have had for many years. This in a division that has recently included the likes of Birmingham, Derby, Ipswich, Sheffield Wednesday and Sunderland.

there was a time from 2008 to about 2014 where school kids all over south wales were wearing city tops....more than I had ever seen before or since. This is in no small part to the (relative) success we had during those years.

A successful city could attract many more fans, but that's true of almost every club.

We must all have a few friends who are happy to attend when we in the premier league (but they still support their team when we play them), but can't be arsed when we play in the championship or below. the aim has to be stopping the next generation picking up the premier league teams in the first place, and thats probably what a lot of other teams do well that we don't

[Dave Blue]

Re: Attendances holding up well

there was a time from 2008 to about 2014 where school kids all over south wales were wearing city tops....more than I had ever seen before or since. This is in no small part to the (relative) success we had during those years.

A successful city could attract many more fans, but that's true of almost every club.

We must all have a few friends who are happy to attend when we in the premier league (but they still support their team when we play them), but can't be arsed when we play in the championship or below. the aim has to be stopping the next generation picking up the premier league teams in the first place, and thats probably what a lot of other teams do well that we don't

We’ve come a long long way regarding attendances. It doesn’t seem an eternity away to me when the highlight of the year was a draw like Oldham in the cup where we may get 6000.

[Feedback]

Re: Attendances holding up well

We’ve come a long long way regarding attendances. It doesn’t seem an eternity away to me when the highlight of the year was a draw like Oldham in the cup where we may get 6000.

those times were 25 years ago...

[Mr Ducie]

Re: Attendances holding up well

Indeed. A wide variety of factors mean that Cardiff City simply isn’t as big a football club as some seem to believe it is.

We’ve recently had people on this board claiming that playing against Cardiff is the biggest game most League One clubs will have had for many years. This in a division that has recently included the likes of Birmingham, Derby, Ipswich, Sheffield Wednesday and Sunderland.

It is a big football club, ask BBM , or Warnock , or McCarthy or fans who support other clubs. The reach of its fan base spans from West Wales to mid Wales and to Holyhead and Bangor.

Are you saying if we had 10 solid seasons on the Premier League, we wouldn’t average 40,000 if we had the stadium capacity?

Historic attendance figures have been impressive.

[Rjk]

Re: Attendances holding up well

The point I’m making is that the City missed the boat at crucial times, we didn’t go up when our local support was buoyant, late 60s/early 70s. That would have been the crucial time, large crowds, football not widespread on tv, for a few seasons knocking on the door. Many say it was the board’s (Fred Dewey) reluctance to go the extra mile in the transfer market that did for us. Our fall from grace for over twenty years when football crowds were generally shite anyway. Italian ‘90 sparked a resurgence, 2 years later the Premier League began, the clubs we’ve named were knocking around the top two divisions, where were we? Our local potential fans were enticed by the ‘Big Time’, fans of other similar sized clubs were part of this ‘Big Time’, their fans were part of it with their local teams……we were home to Rochdale, away to Hartlepool etc, we didn’t have a prayer.

Yes this is exactly my thoughts - the 20 odd years we spend knocking around in the basement divisions coincided with the massive growth of tv coverage and marketing of the premier league - even before that in the late 80s everyone in my primary school was a Liverpool or Man Utd fan I was probably in secondary school before I was even aware that Cardiff had a football team.

Obviously a lot more people watch football on TV than in the grounds which didn't used to be the case - and we weren't on TV and the liverpools were.

Other clubs like Norwich, Derby, Sunderland etc weren't exactly top sides, but had enough success to insulate enough of the fans in the area from drifting off to becoming premier league TV fans - hence they have a much higher base attendance than us.
If they had a prolonged period outside the top 2 divisions they would also lose a generation of fans.

I don't think there are any short cuts to growing the fanbase, a prolonged spell in the premier league would obviously have a lasting impact, but we are a long way from that at the moment