Attendances holding up well

[Mr Ducie]

Re: Attendances holding up well

I literally have no idea what the debate (if it can be described as such) actually is, at least where you're concerned.

You've spent half of this thread agreeing with me while telling me I'm wrong.

In another thread, you suggested that my brain is wired differently to yours. I'm just thankful for small mercies.

Any thread which you’re involved with ends up like this simply because you are desperate for it to fit your agenda.

It’s simply easier to make small allowances for you otherwise we could be here until next Christmas. You drain the life out of nearly every single thread your involved in as many others have pointed out.

[The Lone Gunman]

Re: Attendances holding up well

It’s simply easier to make small allowances for you otherwise we could be here until next Christmas.

What you actually mean is you agree with the facts I've presented (and you've no choice but to do so given that they are facts rather than opinions), but you're desperate to take a different position regardless. Because your brain is wired differently.

[Mr Ducie]

Re: Attendances holding up well

Here you go again.

As I said the other day, why is it you take every single subject so literally, are you wired differently. ( I guess you must have given it some consideration to mention it again )

Remind me not to get into any particular topic with you again.

[The Lone Gunman]

Re: Attendances holding up well

As you did under your previous username, you seem to have taken to following me around this board while attempting to make personal digs. That's not a problem as far as I'm concerned, water off a duck's back and it's quite entertaining at times. However, discussing anything sensibly with you is practically impossible as you often tell me I'm wrong and then introduce information that suggests I'm right in an attempt to prove I'm wrong. It's bizarre. It's as if you don't understand the facts you're presenting, let alone the facts anyone else presents.

Am I wired differently to you? I think so and sincerely hope so. I'd be seeking help if I wasn't.

[Mr Ducie]

Re: Attendances holding up well

As you did under your previous username, you seem to have taken to following me around this board while attempting to make personal digs. That's not a problem as far as I'm concerned, water off a duck's back and it's quite entertaining at times. However, discussing anything sensibly with you is practically impossible as you often tell me I'm wrong and then introduce information that suggests I'm right in an attempt to prove I'm wrong. It's bizarre. It's as if you don't understand the facts you're presenting, let alone the facts anyone else presents.

Am I wired differently to you? I think so and sincerely hope so. I'd be seeking help if I wasn't.

Touched a nerve did I ? You’re not that special to be followed around , but your anti club agenda is predictable and entertaining.

You simply cannot accept a different opinion.

[The Lone Gunman]

Re: Attendances holding up well

Touched a nerve did I ? You’re not that special to be followed around , but your anti club agenda is predictable and entertaining. You simply cannot accept a different opinion.

You're going to have to try a whole lot harder if you want to touch any of my nerves (although please try to behave yourself this time as I don't want to see you getting banned again).

One of the weirdest things in this thread is you're accusing me of having an anti-club agenda and talking the club down when in fact I've been doing the exact opposite. I've suggested that recent attendances have been a bit disappointing under the circumstances and the club, its players and its manager deserve a bit more support from the South Wales public than they are currently getting.

Maybe you don't agree with that. Perhaps you associate more with the supporters who are staying away than those who are attending games. Who knows? I gave up trying to work out what you're thinking a long time ago.

[splott parker]

Re: Attendances holding up well

The last 16 years have been very good. Historically there have been impressive attendance figures particularly between 1946 and 1955 with some attendance figures over 60,000.
FA Cup games with Leeds in 72, Everton in 78 ? Hereford in 76 ? And we hold the Third Division South attendance record of over 49,200

https://european-football-statistics...eague/carc.htm

Not sure where you’ve got that we’ve had some attendances over 60,000, our club record is just under 58,000 against Arsenal in 1953. Wales have had 60,000 +, not us though.

[Mr Ducie]

Re: Attendances holding up well

You're going to have to try a whole lot harder if you want to touch any of my nerves (although please try to behave yourself this time as I don't want to see you getting banned again).

One of the weirdest things in this thread is you're accusing me of having an anti-club agenda and talking the club down when in fact I've been doing the exact opposite. I've suggested that recent attendances have been a bit disappointing under the circumstances and the club, its players and its manager deserve a bit more support from the South Wales public than they are currently getting.

Maybe you don't agree with that. Perhaps you associate more with the supporters who are staying away than those who are attending games. Who knows? I gave up trying to work out what you're thinking a long time ago.

You don’t even realise you have an anti club agenda , that’s your problem. You’re entertaining though.

[goats]

Re: Attendances holding up well

I said: "In terms of attendances, Cardiff City is a mid-ranking second tier club with the potential to attract reasonably big attendances for occasional games."

You have subsequently suggested that, in terms of attendances, Cardiff City is a mid-ranking second tier club with the potential to attract reasonably big attendances for occasional games.

I also said: "It's a big club by League One standards, but not as big as some people seem to believe."

You apparently believe that's not true, but I'm certain it is. Here's my logic:

The following are the top three average attendances for League One in each of the last five seasons:

2021/22:

33,062 - Sunderland
22,908 - Sheffield Wednesday
21,779 - Ipswich Town

2022/23:

27,259 - Derby County
26,184 - Ipswich Town
25,647 - Sheffield Wednesday

2023/24:

27,278 - Derby County
23,193 - Bolton Wanderers
18,953 - Portsmouth

2024/25:

26,326 - Birmingham City
21,325 - Bolton Wanderers
18,817 - Huddersfield Town

2025/26 (at present):

21,853 - Bolton Wanderers
20,588 - Bradford City
18,898 - Cardiff City

Quite incredible really, Sunderland, sheff weds, Ipswich and Derby, all easily PL size clubs…..every one of them is a football mad town.
Cardiff isn’t.

[delmbox]

Re: Attendances holding up well

Have you ever looked at your posts at all , I think it’s already been said by other posters what you’re like and it doesn’t make a good impression at all on you.

Don’t take it personally what other people think if it doesn’t work for you, it’s no good for you or your blood pressure.

So, have you been to any of the fans forums and spoke with BBM on his impressions of the club or do you think it’s media bias ��

well personally I'm glad you're back, you're nothing if not fun to watch

[The Lone Gunman]

Re: Attendances holding up well

Not sure where you’ve got that we’ve had some attendances over 60,000, our club record is just under 58,000 against Arsenal in 1953. Wales have had 60,000 +, not us though.

This is a little more complicated than you might think.

Originally, almost all football history books contained the crowd figures clubs had released to the press after each game. However, a project undertaken by historian Brian Tabner during the 1990’s revealed that the figures given to the press often differed significantly to the ‘official’ attendances declared by clubs to the Football League.

The method for calculating the figures given to the press varied from club to club and year to year, and they were often rounded up or down, but the figures given to the Football League were always based on the same criteria. That was the actual number of tickets sold regardless of whether the ticket holders had turned up or not. This was because clubs had to pay a levy to the league for each game based on every ticket sold.

Right up until the mid-sixties, Cardiff City tended to provide the press with estimated attendance figures based on the number of people that had physically passed through the turnstiles. But occasionally, the club would give the press the same figure as they were declaring to the Football League, which was the overall number of tickets sold (including season ticket holders), and that happened for the Arsenal game in April 1953.

The attendance for that match is recorded in all of the history books as being 57,893, and that figure matches exactly the one contained within the official Football League ledgers. Therefore, we know for sure that 57,893 tickets were sold for that game, but we don’t know for certain how many people actually attended on the day.

There was a Second Division game against Swansea Town in August 1949 for which we have two different attendance figures. The club told the press that 57,510 fans were admitted on the day, but the official figure for all tickets sold that was sent by the club to the Football League and which appears in the FL ledgers is 60,855.

It’s generally accepted that the Arsenal game in 1953 saw the record attendance at Ninian Park for a Football League encounter, but I believe the Swansea game in 1949 holds the record as it’s almost certain the physical attendance for Arsenal was a bit lower than it was for Swansea.

[Rock_Flock_of_Five]

Re: Attendances holding up well

This is a little more complicated than you might think.

Originally, almost all football history books contained the crowd figures clubs had released to the press after each game. However, a project undertaken by historian Brian Tabner during the 1990’s revealed that the figures given to the press often differed significantly to the ‘official’ attendances declared by clubs to the Football League.

The method for calculating the figures given to the press varied from club to club and year to year, and they were often rounded up or down, but the figures given to the Football League were always based on the same criteria. That was the actual number of tickets sold regardless of whether the ticket holders had turned up or not. This was because clubs had to pay a levy to the league for each game based on every ticket sold.

Right up until the mid-sixties, Cardiff City tended to provide the press with estimated attendance figures based on the number of people that had physically passed through the turnstiles. But occasionally, the club would give the press the same figure as they were declaring to the Football League, which was the overall number of tickets sold (including season ticket holders), and that happened for the Arsenal game in April 1953.

The attendance for that match is recorded in all of the history books as being 57,893, and that figure matches exactly the one contained within the official Football League ledgers. Therefore, we know for sure that 57,893 tickets were sold for that game, but we don’t know for certain how many people actually attended on the day.

There was a Second Division game against Swansea Town in August 1949 for which we have two different attendance figures. The club told the press that 57,510 fans were admitted on the day, but the official figure for all tickets sold that was sent by the club to the Football League and which appears in the FL ledgers is 60,855.

It’s generally accepted that the Arsenal game in 1953 saw the record attendance at Ninian Park for a Football League encounter, but I believe the Swansea game in 1949 holds the record as it’s almost certain the physical attendance for Arsenal was a bit lower than it was for Swansea.

I must admit to being surprised that a game against Swansea would perhaps be the highest attended league game at Ninian Park.

I know an intense rivalry developed since the early 80s (Toshack's reign as manager), but I didn't think there would be enough interest back then against Swansea Town.
Not sure if the post-war social environment contributed to it or not, and to what degree those travelling from West Wales would have swelled the attendance that day?

[Feedback]

Re: Attendances holding up well

This is a little more complicated than you might think.

Originally, almost all football history books contained the crowd figures clubs had released to the press after each game. However, a project undertaken by historian Brian Tabner during the 1990’s revealed that the figures given to the press often differed significantly to the ‘official’ attendances declared by clubs to the Football League.

The method for calculating the figures given to the press varied from club to club and year to year, and they were often rounded up or down, but the figures given to the Football League were always based on the same criteria. That was the actual number of tickets sold regardless of whether the ticket holders had turned up or not. This was because clubs had to pay a levy to the league for each game based on every ticket sold.

Right up until the mid-sixties, Cardiff City tended to provide the press with estimated attendance figures based on the number of people that had physically passed through the turnstiles. But occasionally, the club would give the press the same figure as they were declaring to the Football League, which was the overall number of tickets sold (including season ticket holders), and that happened for the Arsenal game in April 1953.

The attendance for that match is recorded in all of the history books as being 57,893, and that figure matches exactly the one contained within the official Football League ledgers. Therefore, we know for sure that 57,893 tickets were sold for that game, but we don’t know for certain how many people actually attended on the day.

There was a Second Division game against Swansea Town in August 1949 for which we have two different attendance figures. The club told the press that 57,510 fans were admitted on the day, but the official figure for all tickets sold that was sent by the club to the Football League and which appears in the FL ledgers is 60,855.

It’s generally accepted that the Arsenal game in 1953 saw the record attendance at Ninian Park for a Football League encounter, but I believe the Swansea game in 1949 holds the record as it’s almost certain the physical attendance for Arsenal was a bit lower than it was for Swansea.

that's real anorak shit.

I'm not criticising, as that is a very interesting fact (about estimates v ticket sales) that I never knew.

[splott parker]

Re: Attendances holding up well

This is a little more complicated than you might think.

Originally, almost all football history books contained the crowd figures clubs had released to the press after each game. However, a project undertaken by historian Brian Tabner during the 1990’s revealed that the figures given to the press often differed significantly to the ‘official’ attendances declared by clubs to the Football League.

The method for calculating the figures given to the press varied from club to club and year to year, and they were often rounded up or down, but the figures given to the Football League were always based on the same criteria. That was the actual number of tickets sold regardless of whether the ticket holders had turned up or not. This was because clubs had to pay a levy to the league for each game based on every ticket sold.

Right up until the mid-sixties, Cardiff City tended to provide the press with estimated attendance figures based on the number of people that had physically passed through the turnstiles. But occasionally, the club would give the press the same figure as they were declaring to the Football League, which was the overall number of tickets sold (including season ticket holders), and that happened for the Arsenal game in April 1953.

The attendance for that match is recorded in all of the history books as being 57,893, and that figure matches exactly the one contained within the official Football League ledgers. Therefore, we know for sure that 57,893 tickets were sold for that game, but we don’t know for certain how many people actually attended on the day.

There was a Second Division game against Swansea Town in August 1949 for which we have two different attendance figures. The club told the press that 57,510 fans were admitted on the day, but the official figure for all tickets sold that was sent by the club to the Football League and which appears in the FL ledgers is 60,855.

It’s generally accepted that the Arsenal game in 1953 saw the record attendance at Ninian Park for a Football League encounter, but I believe the Swansea game in 1949 holds the record as it’s almost certain the physical attendance for Arsenal was a bit lower than it was for Swansea.

It’s ‘overall tickets sold’ that baffles me, up until the time I bought a season ticket, the only tickets I actually purchased in advance of a game were the odd ECWC game and a few FA Cup ties (Arsenal, Leeds etc). I just turned up, paid cash at the turnstile and went it. Whether the turnstile operator ‘clicked’ every supporter, who knows? I s’pose a few of them left the ground considerably heavier.

[The Lone Gunman]

Re: Attendances holding up well

I must admit to being surprised that a game against Swansea would perhaps be the highest attended league game at Ninian Park. I know an intense rivalry developed since the early 80s (Toshack's reign as manager), but I didn't think there would be enough interest back then against Swansea Town. Not sure if the post-war social environment contributed to it or not, and to what degree those travelling from West Wales would have swelled the attendance that day?

The rivalry stretches back as far as the first Football League Division Two game between the sides in 1929. I'm in the office today, so don't have my history books with me, but I'll provide you with some figures this evening. I think they are interesting.

The early-season game in 1949 had added local interest as City had finished fourth in Division Two the previous year, while Swansea were the reigning Third Division (South) champions. The post-war attendance boom across football also contributed - crowds were really big for a few years all over the country once the Football League had restarted.